This topic

Unable to order Fibre 900 - ECI issue? FTTP

kernowlogic — Fri, 22 Jan 2021 11:59:44 GMT

Since December 2019 I've been experiencing issues attempting to upgrade my service. When I first signed up in Jan 2018, I had options ranging from 50mb to 300mb. I started with 50mb. Some time in 2019, I attempted to upgrade to 300 only to discover that I wasn't able to upgrade via the BT website. I called BT and they moved me to 75mb (an option also not showing on the website, but said that they'd look into why 300mb wasn't showing as available).

In June 2020 I received an email saying that 'you've been chosen' with links to upgrade to 100mb, 500mb, or 900mb. I attempted to upgrade to 900mb and had the same issue as before - unable to upgrade via the BT website. I called up BT who informed me that 900mb wasn't available in my area yet (although the BT website confirmed my address, postcode and house name, as being able to receive these speeds). Instead I was told that 300(330) was available, and so I upgraded to that.

6 months have passed and the BT website states my address can receive anything from fibre essential 36mb up to 900mb - but still I'm unable to upgrade to 900mb (or 500mb for that matter), and the openreach site shows I can get up to 1gigabit too.

After speaking with the BT broadband / upgrade team - they said I should be able to get it and contacted the full fibre team on my behalf who said I couldn't get it. The upgrade team said I should speak to connections - I spoke with them but they said they dealt with copper / FTTC rather than FTTP. Still, they checked into it and also said I should be able to get fibre 900. They suggested I speak directly with the full fibre team - so I did. They confirmed after doing a tech check that I couldn't get fibre 900, only up to 300(330). However, they mentioned that it might be because my ONT (modem) was old which made sense and has lead me to find out that fibre 900 is not available on ECI telecom hardware - only Nokia and Huawei. Reading some more, it's not possible to just change out the ONT, as the head end (which I believe is at the exchange) would also need to be changed out.

So the short of it is:

> How do I confirm I'm on ECI head end? I'm pretty certain I'm on ECI ONT / Modem and I think ECI ONT = ECI head end.

> Presumably the exchange now has the hardware to offer fibre 900, but I'd need to be switched over - or is there more to it than that?

> If I could be switched over at the exchange, I'd also need a new ONT / Modem to match whether it's Huawei or Nokia at the exchange.

> Or is it just a case of waiting until BT upgrade the exchange and then contact me to upgrade the modem too - will that ever happen? It seems unlikely.

If I'm completely wrong, it'd be helpful to know too as so far I've pieced this together from my last call with the full fibre team and then various articles across the internet.

Thanks in advance

Matt

Re: Unable to order Fibre 900 - ECI issue? FTTP

Starwire — Fri, 22 Jan 2021 12:51:40 GMT

If you have an ECI ONT I guarantee you the Head End will also be ECI because unlike VDSL Modems ONT’s are not interchangeable, i.e. ECI ONT’s will only work on ECI Head Ends like Nokia will only work on Nokia Head Ends.

Re: Unable to order Fibre 900 - ECI issue? FTTP

kernowlogic — Fri, 22 Jan 2021 12:51:13 GMT

Based on the serial number of the ONT starting with ECI, I'm assuming it is and that confirms what I've found about not being able to mix ECI ONT with Huawei / Nokia head ends.

Re: Unable to order Fibre 900 - ECI issue? FTTP

Starwire — Fri, 22 Jan 2021 12:52:32 GMT

Can you upload a photo of it, I’ll know for sure then.

Re: Unable to order Fibre 900 - ECI issue? FTTP

kernowlogic — Fri, 22 Jan 2021 14:07:20 GMT

As I edited out the MAC, I spotted the ECI Telecom LTD brand on the bottom left of the sticker which probably confirmation enough 😅, but here is the back anyway. Can't believe I didn't spot that part before. That's point 1 covered then.

I guess it's a question to BT full fibre how I can be switched over to non-ECI (if that's possible) once bt / openreach are able to begin installs / changes again.

Has anyone got any experience of that and any success?

Re: Unable to order Fibre 900 - ECI issue? FTTP

licquorice — Fri, 22 Jan 2021 14:15:05 GMT

Perhaps you missed the part where @Starwire explained if the ONT is ECI then the head end will be ECI, and that the 2 have to be the same. Therefore for you to move away from ECI would entail not only changing the head end but every customer off that head end.

Re: Unable to order Fibre 900 - ECI issue? FTTP

kernowlogic — Fri, 22 Jan 2021 14:57:41 GMT

Thanks. Yes, my understanding in the original post was that "...it's not possible to just change out the ONT, as the head end (which I believe is at the exchange) would also need to be changed out." "ECI ONT = ECI head end."

Understood that changing the head end would then require changing every customer off that head end too. That's not really something I'd considered due to my lack of knowledge of how the physical network works - as I say, so far I've pieced together bits of info from the internet after one member of the full fibre team suggested it might be that my ONT is too old. That was the first and only bit of useful information I'd had other than 'you should be able to get it, but you can't'.

I suppose it's just a case of my final point - wait until BT upgrade the exchange and contact me (and every other affected customer) to replace the ONT which is unlikely to happen in the next 5-10years. Fortunately 300mb is great anyway, just confusing when BT are contacting me offering me to upgrade to speeds they're unable to provide to me.

Thanks for your input both - good to know that I'm unable to go any faster for now.

Re: Unable to order Fibre 900 - ECI issue? FTTP

Starwire — Fri, 22 Jan 2021 15:28:19 GMT

I’ve heard rumours Openreach are going to swap out ECI Head Ends with Nokia and or Huawei.

If and how that would be done I don’t know but I’m I’d imagine it would be a logistical nightmare as they’d need to swap out all the ONT’s on that particular Head End at the same time to avoid people being without Service.

Re: Unable to order Fibre 900 - ECI issue? FTTP

CornwallGold — Thu, 18 Nov 2021 23:39:27 GMT

So I am in the very same situation as the OP. I have 300mbps, checker shows 900mbps availability, but a "line check" on order limits me to 300.

I have an ECI ONT, thus an ECI head end in the exchange that is limiting the max capacity.

There is however, light at the end of the tunnel (I hope).

The fact that 900 shows as avaiable at your address indicates that the network on your street is fed from different head ends. You are probably on blown fibre, and there has been an overlay of the more modern and cheaper to install connectorised block terminal system, routed to a Huawei or Nokia head end.

I have a complaint open with BT at present to resolve this, and to be fair they have been very understanding and worked with me to find a solution.

Initially they took the question to openreach, who it seems said "No, 300mbps is the max, goodbye" which wasn't helpful. I am currently in the process of a "cease and reprovide" to see if that works. In brief, my service is to be cancelled and another (for 900mbps) is then ordered. The new order system might just see the ECI service at my address and say no, 300 max, or it might trigger a complete new install to the connectorised system and a 900 mbps capable head end.

If the ordering system does still say no, there is a final method I discussed with BT. Whilst keeping my current service live, order a second, 900mbps service. This will then be fed from the newer equipment. The key here will be to ensure that it is ordered as a complete new provide, not a SUB-provide - this would simply liven up port two of the existing ECI ONT, and hence would only be capable of 300mbps! Once the completely new service is live, the old ECI service is obviously ceased.

So there you go. A possible solution. I will keep yo uup to date as we go, currently all I can see is my cease date, next Tuesday 23rd. Wish me luck!

Re: Unable to order Fibre 900 - ECI issue? FTTP

kernowlogic — Mon, 22 Nov 2021 12:12:44 GMT

Been a while since I last looked at this ticket. Would be great to know how you get on. I've contacted BT a couple of times recently to query whether the 900mbps service is in my area, and it seems to be - but I still can't upgrade.

I keep receiving emails from BT suggesting I can upgrade, but I'm unable to.

Were you out of contract at the point that you initiated the cease on your existing connection?

Re: Unable to order Fibre 900 - ECI issue? FTTP

CornwallGold — Mon, 22 Nov 2021 17:55:03 GMT

"Were you out of contract at the point that you initiated the cease on your existing connection?"

No, I've recently renewed my contract.

Re: Unable to order Fibre 900 - ECI issue? FTTP

Dave-Helston — Fri, 24 Dec 2021 11:54:23 GMT

How did you get on @CornwallGold as I'm in same boat as you and had no joy via BT complaint.

Re: Unable to order Fibre 900 - ECI issue? FTTP

CornwallGold — Mon, 03 Jan 2022 16:34:46 GMT

Hi Dave.

Apologies for the lack of updates, been a busy time. Also sorry about War and Peace, just want to get the details in.

So in short, a cease and reprovide did not work, the Openreach system still saw an ECI service in place, so 330mbps was the highest possible to order.

The BT help team then went back to Openreach with a more detailed request, but that got no useful response.

With the help team we have formulated a new plan. Another cease and reprovide order was placed, and the cease has happened (I am currently running on 4g "hybrid connect" at about 25mbps)

Once the line had ceased, BT called me and asked me to disconnect my ONT (pull the green plug) before the provide process. As the provide then failed (could not "see" the ONT) an engineer is booked to arrive and complete an install. This engineer will then "find" no spare links on the SASA back to the ECI head end from the splitter, and request a routing change onto another SASA. All other SASAs link back to Huawei head ends, so an ONT swap will also be needed.

Once the routing swap is completed the service will be back up and running at the ordered 330mbps. Then it's just a matter of upgrading, and finally we should be there.

The BT help team have been absolutely brilliant in their help and understanding on this. Hopefully once this is over we can create a simple process for the everyday customer to upgrade an ECI service.

Re: Unable to order Fibre 900 - ECI issue? FTTP

Starwire — Mon, 03 Jan 2022 20:53:22 GMT

‘Once the line had ceased, BT called me and asked me to disconnect my ONT (pull the green plug) before the provide process. As the provide then failed (could not "see" the ONT) an engineer is booked to arrive and complete an install. This engineer will then "find" no spare links on the SASA back to the ECI head end from the splitter, and request a routing change onto another SASA. All other SASAs link back to Huawei head ends, so an ONT swap will also be needed.’

Did this actually happen yet and has it been agreed between BT and Openreach.

If not here is the big flaw in BT’s plan.

Openreach will see an ONT Associated with the address, it being an ECI one and they will Order/Build your Service off the existing route like they would a ‘Stopped’ Line on a Metallic Path.

Of course when they activate it it’ll not see the ONT as it’s unplugged so they’ll generate an Engineer Visit to investigate.

Said Engineer will just simply plug the ONT back in to get it working. You could of course remove the ONT and play the idiot card but the Engineer will firstly see through you then just go to his/her van to get a replacement ECI ONT.

Also what’s this about there being no spare fibres back to the SASA? You already have a Fibre back to the SASA, they wouldn’t need to go looking for a spare and for all BT know there could be a dozen spares off that SASA.

Also do BT know if the the Fibre back to the Huawei Head End is even on the same PON as the ECI one, because I seriously doubt it is.

Re: Unable to order Fibre 900 - ECI issue? FTTP

CornwallGold — Mon, 03 Jan 2022 21:44:28 GMT

Hi Starwire.

You're right of course, an engineer would indeed simply recommission/replace the ONT, however the whole point is that the engineer won't do that, as arranged.

"Also what’s this about there being no spare fibres back to the SASA? You already have a Fibre back to the SASA, they wouldn’t need to go looking for a spare and for all BT know there could be a dozen spares off that SASA.

Also do BT know if the the Fibre back to the Huawei Head End is even on the same PON as the ECI one, because I seriously doubt it is."

There's obviously my existing fibre BACK to the SASA - that doesn't change. It's the fibres ON the SASA back to the ECI head end that have no spares (maybe my original fibre has been snapped off too short to re-splice, which is why my ONT can't be seen?) so a SASA change will be required.

And yes, in my splitter SASA 1 is ECI, SASAs 2,3 and 4 are Huawei. I did some home work.

If you want to delve deeper into my individual case it's probably better if you PM me.

Re: Unable to order Fibre 900 - ECI issue? FTTP

Starwire — Tue, 04 Jan 2022 06:36:37 GMT

You asking me to PM you because you plan on damaging the Fibre, aka Openreach’s Equipment and don’t want to openly say it out loud? Where are you planning on damaging it, the CSP or have you somehow managed to get the Routing for your existing Fibre and plan on damaging it in the possible various Track Joints back to the Splitter or in the Splitter itself?

If you are why would they not simply just fix/replace it?

Also the other SASA’s will be on different Head End Ports so they won’t be able to get a Reroute on the day. It’d need to go back for an entire NAD Key Reset and the an Entire Profile Rebuild.

If SASA1, which is on the ECI Head End is at capacity why didn’t the genius at BT who keeps Ceasing and Reproviding your Circuit not just Order you a second FTTP Line, which would have to come off one of the other SASA’s if the fist is full and then when it was installed Cease the other?

Re: Unable to order Fibre 900 - ECI issue? FTTP

CornwallGold — Tue, 04 Jan 2022 10:35:47 GMT

Wow.

I'm not sure exactly why you're getting upset about this. I (with the help of a great BT help team) am trying to fix an issue with the BT/Openreach ordering system.

I am posting it on here as a courtesy to hopefully help the OP and others in the same situation.

I resent your suggestion that I would damage the fibre, that is a ridiculous suggestion.

The visiting engineer will be asked by BT to move me to another SASA, apply for the reroute and fit a new ONT. This will not happen on the same day, I understand that.

Ordering a second service was tried, but the system would just automatically route that to port 2 of the existing ECI ONT, not helping at all.

I believe if I was a BT business customer, I could stipulate a second line has to be on a separate fibre, but not a home user.

It is the BT/Openreach ordering system that has barriers in it that simply won't allow the order of 900mbps if a property has ECI, we are trying to ascertain a method of working around this until BT and/or Openreach start to care about their (relatively very few) customers on ECI.

Re: Unable to order Fibre 900 - ECI issue? FTTP

kernowlogic — Tue, 04 Jan 2022 14:30:51 GMT

As the OP, I'd just like to thank you for providing such detailed updates.

Please do keep posting your progress, it will be useful to understand the correct procedure to advise BT of the necessary changes if it is successful. It took so long just to get someone from BT to explain to me why I couldn't receive the 900mbps even though they kept contacting me telling me I could upgrade. It was only by chance that I stumbled upon someone who must've had some experience of this before with another customer that they could at least explain why I couldn't receive the higher speeds.

The information in the replies has been very useful and at least provides some hope that I may be able to move to the faster service at some point in the future.

Re: Unable to order Fibre 900 - ECI issue? FTTP

Starwire — Tue, 04 Jan 2022 19:04:09 GMT

I didn’t suggest you were going to damage the Fibre, you did.

‘There's obviously my existing fibre BACK to the SASA - that doesn't change. It's the fibres ON the SASA back to the ECI head end that have no spares (maybe my original fibre has been snapped off too short to re-splice, which is why my ONT can't be seen?) so a SASA change will be required.’

Or we’re you just speaking hypothetically, in which case as I said, they can just replace the fibre.

Also as I said before, which I’ve come across before you can’t do a SASA Reroute from one Head End Port to another as your OGEA Service is built off that one, the whole Service would need to be Ceased then for it to go to planning for a complete NAD Key Reset.

Re: Unable to order Fibre 900 - ECI issue? FTTP

Starwire — Tue, 04 Jan 2022 19:05:16 GMT

What BT are doing isn’t a Process. It’s merely trial and error. Well more error than anything.