This topic

BT Cloud Windows Client version 21.8.9

PaddyB — Mon, 01 Nov 2021 15:38:45 GMT

Hi All,

Firstly, thank you to all of you who’ve shared feedback with us and for your patience.

We’ve completed our internal testing and can now share the latest version of BT Cloud for Windows with you.

It can be downloaded from the link below:

https://btcloud.bt.com/web/app/share/invite/wLBk0yaxoA

There is no need to uninstall the previous version.

We’ve rewritten the desktop client resulting in faster uploads and downloads. The performance improvements will be most notable when the client backs up content for the first time.

The new design has improved CPU and RAM utilization to reduce the likelihood of clogging computer resources.

We look forward to hearing your feedback on this latest version.

Thanks,

Paddy

Re: BT Cloud Windows Client version 21.8.9

henryfm — Fri, 05 Nov 2021 18:36:25 GMT

It's good that after 11 months I was able to install this new version of BT Cloud on both my PCs, and it ran, albeit in the background whilst initialising. The fact that it is doing something can be checked by setting Diagnostic logging, once active by default but now needing to be selcted from About BT Cloud on the menu (3 vertical dots) from the update progress display. The log files can be ginormous, so not worth creating unless you have concerns.

A word of warning: If you are using Sync, monitor the Recently Updated list to check that if a file is downloaded from the Cloud, it is handled correctly. When I clicked on the downloaded file shown on the screenshot, I was taken to File Explorer which showed the folder this file had been downloaded to. The downloaded file appeared with a modification date of 10th August 2021, but a more recent version of the file (modified 31st October 2021) had been renamed with the epithet '( conflicted copy 2021-11-03 21.52.50+00)'. This means that if I selected this file from the recently used file list of an app, I would get the old version, not the current version. i.e. for me, BT Cloud is setting my file lists in aspic; I have to rename files to use the most recent versions. Hence I have paused syncing awaiting discussion with BT Cloud help, with a log file to submit. For further background, see my post 'Can we see the light at the end of the tunnel?'

Of course, it's quite possible that Sync works perfectly for you, the old version of a file being marked with the 'conflicted' epithet. But if you do observe the same behaviour that I have experienced (a) immediately pause syncing and (b) report it to BT Cloud Help (and as a reply here). You can most easily find files marked as conflicted in File Explorer and searching your BTCloud folder for 'conflicted'. Sort files by Modified Date. Conflicted files created before December 2019 are correct - this is where, if a newer version of a file edited on a different PC was uploaded to the Cloud and was then downloaded to the first PC, the old version was marked as conflicted. It's those created recently you need to work through to check whether it's the new or old version that has been marked as 'Conflicted' - if the new version is 'Conflicted', you need to manually rename the old file first (I add '- conflict' to the filename, without the quotes, so that it will not be found when I search for 'conflicted') and then remove the epithet from the new file. Restarting Sync would just repeat and continue the incorrect processing.

Hopefully, other users are not experiencing this. With V21.4.9 I didn't have this problem if I only used Sync with one PC (effectively using Sync as Backup, with the plan to add the second PC again, when the issue was resolved). But with V21.8.9 incorrect files are marked as Conflicted when only working with one PC.

Re: BT Cloud Windows Client version 21.8.9

RTL — Tue, 16 Nov 2021 11:36:17 GMT

@PaddyB @henryfm

Well I was browsing on my laptop last night and discovered this updated post to BT Cloud 21.8.9. So I decided to install it. I currently only use Sync between my two Desktops (Windows 11 Pro 21H2 Version 2200.318) and my Laptop (Windows 10 Pro 21H1 Version 19043.1348). It installed no problem and synced up o.k. I then ran Belarc Advisor and saved the file to my BT Cloud. This could have been my fault, finger trouble, but I ended up with a conflicted file!! First time I have ever seen this. I need to investigate this further as it was getting late and I had other things to do. The file with the "proper name" is empty -- 0KB.

Conflicting File

So this morning I thought I'd install it on my Desktop "A". To my surprise--21.8.9 was on it already !!! I don't recall getting any prompt that it was about to install but it had. (For the 21.4.10 I had a notification that a restart was required to install the new version. That was on Windows 10 though.) It looks like it was installed yesterday. I had the PC powered on in the morning but it was then off until I powered the PC on around 4:30 to do my fish tank file .

So I opened the fish tank Excel document I had created yesterday and saved it as TEST_16th_November. Did some changes to it and then just did a save---leaving the title alone. It got loaded up to the Cloud. I then opened it a few minutes later, did some changes and again saved it. Checked in the Cloud and the file was now timed with the latest time stamp. No old file there or in the Trash Bin.

Powered up my laptop and it synced up o.k. Opened Excel and made changes to the file. Again I just saved it and closed Excel. Checked in the Cloud that it was updated and then went back to my Desktop. It had downloaded the latest file as well--and I only get the one. So I never see the conflict that Henry seems to get--other than the occasion on the Laptop.

Cloud after Laptop updated file.

Checked Desktop "B", also Windows 11 Pro and it is still on 21.4.10.

Re: BT Cloud Windows Client version 21.8.9

RTL — Fri, 19 Nov 2021 10:08:43 GMT

@PaddyB @henryfm Well I proved that it was not finger trouble on my part that gave me the previous conflicted file on my Laptop, X551CA. I got the exact same result when I repeated the task last night. I also updated the laptop to the Windows 10 21H2 feature which was now available for download and it still failed.

So I resurrected my other Desktop- A97LE . I installed BT Cloud 21.8.9 and ran Belarc Adviser. It failed. Updated Windows to 21H2--same. Uninstalled 21.8.9 and installed 21.4.10. Works every time.

I only use Edge for browsing on my PC's but also have Firefox on them. I avoid anything with Google involved! So this morning I made Firefox the default browser on my Laptop. On my first attempt at running Belarc, BT Cloud threw up an error and paused syncing. I hit the resume syncing and it went up o.k. Repeated the task and it worked fine. Also saved a pdf file of the BBC news page. No problem.

Set FF as default on the A97LE with 21.8.9 and ran Belarc. Works o.k.

So to summarise:-

21.4.10 works on all my PC's using Edge whether running Windows 10 or 11.

21.8.9 works on my Win 11 Desktops but not on the Win 10 PCs using Edge.

Summary

Edge Versions

Re: BT Cloud Windows Client version 21.8.9

henryfm — Sun, 21 Nov 2021 11:40:08 GMT

@RTL @PaddyB

Interesting observations, John, but raising more questions than it answers.

For the X5S1CA conflicted file, you show the BT Cloud Web repository listing; you do not show the File Explorer listing for these files in the folder on the client PC. My understanding is that files are renamed with the 'conflicted' epithet on the client, not in the web repository. The Update Progress or log file records may help to illuminate exactly what happened. My suggestion is that when started creation of your X5S1CA pdf file, it was synced up to the cloud before it had been populated, i.e. in the 37 seconds between the file being created and modification being complete. Later, BT Cloud detected that the client version had been changed. So V 21.8.9 would send the (empty) repository version back to the client PC and mark the newer populated version as a 'conflicted' version. Subsequently, the new conflicted file was uploaded to the web repository.

As I noted previously: V21.4.10 can be used for backup using synchronisation from one PC, conflicts only occuring when I actually try to synchronise between PCs. V21.8.9 creates incorrect conflict files just with one PC client, as has now happened for John. The mix of V21.4.10 and V 21.8.9 does not help interpretation; V 21.8.9 oaded on my W10 machines with no problems.

John, for your experiment with the fish tank Excel file, have you checked File Explorer for conflict versions of the file on the client PCs? With the process you describe you SHOULD get conflict versions. Created on PC1 and edited, transferred to PC2 via sync, edited, resynced and a copy put on PC1. What should happen is that the OLD version on PC1 will be marked as a conflict file (so that it is not lost), but the new version made available for further processing. Provided you have allowed time for synchronisation, you can edit the same file on 2 or more PCs freely. What I find to be going wrong at present is that the NEW version on PC1 is marked as a conflict file, the OLD version being offered for further processing, so an old version is offered for editing.

Your X5S1CA problem relates to very short term incorrect conflict behaviour. The Streap example in my previous posting was on my desktop. The following extract is from my laptop, the conflicts arising after V21.8.9 was installed and after I'd updated 8 files over the summer without BT Cloud operating. In every case, the old version of the file was suggested to be the required active version, mostly from 2020, one from 2018.

I created the Streap example mentioned above when I'd set the log file to be active on my desktop, pausing sync once I noticed the conflict to avoid further problems. I'm awaiting the phone call from Stephen of BT Cloud support to discuss the problem and submit the log file evidence for interrogation.

Re: BT Cloud Windows Client version 21.8.9

RTL — Sun, 21 Nov 2021 11:46:12 GMT

@PaddyB @henryfm Microsoft releases updates every 4 weeks or so for Edge. On the 19th. they released 96.0.1054.29. So yesterday, the 20th I ensured BT Cloud Diagnostic Logging was enabled on both my Windows 10 Desktop "C" (A97LE) and the Laptop X5551CA.

Started with the Desktop "C". Ran Belarc and then selected to print the result as a pdf file to my Belarc Folder in BT Cloud. On the first attempt which was using Edge 95.0.1020.53 I got the conflicted file at 16:30. Updated Edge to 96.0.1054.29 and reran it. When I tried to save it, BT Cloud came up with an "Unexpected error". I had to click on Resume Syncing whereupon it continued the load--no conflicting file at 16:42. I then ran Belarc a few minutes later and it uploaded o.k. --17:00.

A97LE Summary

Later I did the exact same procedure on the Laptop with the same result. Edge 95 gives the conflicted file 19:13--96 on first attempt at upload gives the BT Cloud error but loads on resuming syncing --19:24. Next attempt at 19:36 is o.k.

X551CA Summary

So at the moment 21.8.9 with Edge 96.0.1054.29 works fine for me. The problem is --in four weeks time Edge will again update and I could be back to square 1! Edge 96 is on my Windows 11 Desktops and they don't have the problem at all. Plus the fact they were only upgraded to Windows 11 on the 6th. October and previous to that were running Windows 10 with BT Cloud 21.4.10 and no problems.

I think we should be making the people concerned aware of this and so I have gathered the dumps,msinfo32 files and some other snapshots and put them into a Shared Folder in my BT Cloud. I have given the specific times of the events so that should narrow down their log examination.

@PaddyB , I will send you the link via PM after this posts. If you need any more info, just get back to me.

Re: BT Cloud Windows Client version 21.8.9

RTL — Sun, 21 Nov 2021 12:11:06 GMT

@henryfm Henry have just seen your reply---we must have been composing at the same time. Apologies but I will look into it later as I've already spent too long on this. Other things need doing.

@PaddyB Have sent the link.

Re: BT Cloud Windows Client version 21.8.9

henryfm — Sun, 21 Nov 2021 13:15:35 GMT

@RTL @PaddyB

I am at a bit of a loss as to the significance of the browser and version of Windows; the BT Cloud system should work on any system. Thus, my 2007 Office suite has continued to work as I progressed from W XP to 7 and now W10. The only problem with the browser has been that FireFox would not access the link to the BT Cloud executable, so I had to use a different browser to get started. Now it is installed, I question how the browser would affect operation of the BT Cloud executable. What does Belarc add to the picture from the Recently Updated list , Web BT Cloud and File Explorer looking at the client PC, plus the log files?

Re: BT Cloud Windows Client version 21.8.9

RTL — Sun, 21 Nov 2021 15:00:13 GMT

@henryfm @PaddyB When I run Belarc, at the completion it opens the default browser to display the results. In my case the default is Microsoft Edge.

at EOJ

I then select Print in the browser or Ctrl + P. change the printer to Microsoft Print to PDF , then Print.

Print to pdf

Then I select the destination, give it a name and save it.

It then downloads to my other PC's where I can access it. I never modify it so wouldn't expect to see a conflicted file. It has never given any problems until I put 21.8.9 on.

I'm going to print off and read your previous reply and try and digest as to how you end up with conflicted files. Then I'll use my Desktop "A" (Excel 2016), Desktop "C" (Excel 2016) and my Laptop (Excel 2013) to replicate your problem. I only use the Free version of Office on Desktop "B" at the moment.

Re: BT Cloud Windows Client version 21.8.9

RTL — Sun, 21 Nov 2021 15:54:58 GMT

@henryfm @PaddyB As regards my fish tank test, both PC's show only one file with the same time stamp.

Desktop "A".

Desktop "A"

Laptop

Laptop X551CA

The file in the Cloud shows a different time!!! No mention of conflicted file anywhere. I'll need to compare the data.

BT Cloud

Re: BT Cloud Windows Client version 21.8.9

RTL — Sun, 21 Nov 2021 17:41:56 GMT

@henryfm @PaddyB Well used Spreadsheet Compare and it says there are no differences. Ticked all the options to check for.

The Files

BT Cloud compared to Desktop "A" file.

BT Cloud compared to Laptop file.

BT Cloud and Laptop Files

Will try the test later if I get time.

Re: BT Cloud Windows Client version 21.8.9

David500 — Sun, 21 Nov 2021 21:52:51 GMT

I've only noticed that v21.8.9 is available and have installed it, but having a problem with the backup stopping with "BT Cloud - Unexpected error" which I was getting in the previous version. I've found the following in the error log:

2021-11-21 21:19:28.070 +00:00 [INF] NotifyError: BT Cloud, File size exceeds the 9.8 GB limit., { SourceContext: "Sncr.Cloud.UI.Platform.ToastService" }
2021-11-21 21:19:28.070 +00:00 [DBG] LegacyDisplayToastContent BT Cloud File size exceeds the 9.8 GB limit., { SourceContext: "Sncr.Cloud.UI.Platform.ToastService" }
2021-11-21 21:19:28.109 +00:00 [DBG] ClientStatus Pause, { SourceContext: "Sncr.Cloud.Model.Workflow.Data.ClientStatus" }
2021-11-21 21:19:28.109 +00:00 [DBG] ClientStatus WaitResume, { SourceContext: "Sncr.Cloud.Model.Workflow.Data.ClientStatus" }

and then this window pops up:

The syncing has stopped and when resumed it just repeats as above.

Re: BT Cloud Windows Client version 21.8.9

RTL — Sun, 21 Nov 2021 22:13:36 GMT

@PaddyB @henryfm

Well looks to me like my sync is working but not like Henry's. I only ever see one file in the Cloud and in my PC's folder.

Using Desktop A, Desktop C and Laptop for this test. I created this Excel file at 19:33 on Desktop A and let it sync up.

I then checked the file was in the Cloud and the other two PC's. I then entered the details at Desktop C. Saved it and closed Xcel at 19:53. Checked it was in the Cloud and then entered more data using the Laptop and saved it at 20:11.Checked the others had it and also the Cloud. Repeated it again from A twice at 20:21 and 20:54.

For all instances there was only one file in the PC folder and the Cloud. All that was happening was the time stamp changing.

Excel File

Cloud status for the whole test showing the relevant file.

Final status and Properties of the file on the PC's

Desktop A.

Desktop A

Desktop C

Laptop

Re: BT Cloud Windows Client version 21.8.9

henryfm — Mon, 22 Nov 2021 11:34:19 GMT

@RTL

Well John, your postings 9 and 11 on this thread provide more light than illumination, but at least with posting 13 you provide a simpler and hence more comprehensible approach than posting 10.

Posting 9 explains in detail a complicated way of creating a file apparently to test synchronisation; there is no indication of what illumination the Belarc software provides to help understand what's going on. It seems to provide an analysis of the computer hardware, nothing to do with synchronisation.

In Posting 10, an existing file seems to have been renamed as TEST_16_Nov (presumably its creation date) on 21 Nov and allowed to sync. It then gets messy with modification dates. Posting 11 shows 3 synced copies of the file, and that they were internally the same. So much better with Posting 13 where a new file was created and then modified as it synced to different machines. Whether Excel, a free version, notepad or wordpad shouldn't matter - it's simple.

Then you show that BT Cloud has synchronised the same file to DT A, DT C and LT. Just as it should be - but wait. What's happened to the older versions of Test_Sync? When BT Cloud downloaded the latest version to a client, has it deleted the old version and replaced it by the new? Not good practice for traceability; in the good old days, the old version would be renamed as a Conflicted version and the new one downloaded as the 'top'version. Maybe the old versions are available on the BT Cloud web, but uncontrolled deletion of a file is not good practice. If a mistake was made in editing, it's good to be able to go back. If inadvertently files of the same name were created on diffferent machines, one would get lost to the ether.

I've created a file to try a similar exercise, but so far (after restarting sync) the file has not uploaded - several antique files have uploaded unnecessarily, and several have downloaded to create incorrect conflicts, but the test file has not uploaded.

BTW John, have you sorted out the problem of having different versions of BT Cloud? For me, V21.8.9, the version appropriate for this thread, works as it does on W10. As versions 21.4.10 and V 21.8.9 have diffferent ways of handling sync, giving me different problems, it's as well to have the latest version throughout.

Re: BT Cloud Windows Client version 21.8.9

henryfm — Mon, 22 Nov 2021 12:32:17 GMT

@RTL

The conflicted files that got created on your system on Postings 3 and 4: are they on your client PCs or on BT Cloud Web? Are they newer or older than the non-conflicted versions? Posting 4 uses the Belarc report rather than the more specific File Explorer for the clients.

Re: BT Cloud Windows Client version 21.8.9

RTL — Mon, 22 Nov 2021 13:34:24 GMT

@henryfm @PaddyB I think we are in dissimilar situations here. I only use SYNC and have nothing set in BACKUP.

My setup

In this post in message #38, JTS1 stated the differences between Sync and Backup. I only use Sync so won't get "old files" saved. If I did accidentally delete a file it's not a problem---you can retrieve it from the Dustbin in BT Cloud. And I also run backups on my PC's so can retrieve from them as well since the BT Cloud folder content is on my "C" drive.

I have the 21.8.9 version of BT Cloud currently on all four PC's.

Re: BT Cloud Windows Client version 21.8.9

RTL — Mon, 22 Nov 2021 14:01:28 GMT

@henryfm @PaddyB The conflicted files have the data--the non-conflicted one is 0 Bytes. They are on my PC's and the Cloud. Your explanation earlier about it not being populated etc could be valid but it has never done that before. If I had been on a different Edge version that didn't exhibit the problem when I installed 21.8.9, I'd have been none the wiser!!

Conflicted File

Edited.:- Forgot to mention that the TEST file dated 21st. Nov. wasn't being synced. To do the Spreadsheet Comparison I had downloaded the file from BT Cloud to an external USB disk so it used that date.

Re: BT Cloud Windows Client version 21.8.9

henryfm — Mon, 22 Nov 2021 17:03:07 GMT

@RTL

I am only using sync - backup would not give conflicted files as its a one-way process. Backup can't conflict with sync as it would be from a different folder on the client PC - e.g. BT Cloud and BT Cloud (1) - to a different repository on the cloud (labelled DESKTOP rather than SYNC on BT Cloud web)

Your observation of an incorrect conflicted file being marked during the backing up phase of files from one client is a new feature of V21.8.9. With V21.4.10, I was using SYNC but from only one PC, so that it was effectively a backup of the main computer. The intention was that when the incorrect identification of confilicted files problem had been resolved, I'd add the laptop again. However, I found that SYNC was incorrectly marking conflicted files on the one computer - the most recently created version of a file was being marked as conflicted so that opening the recent file in Excel (for example) I'd not get the version with the most recent update. Generally, I use the laptop for one main application. Temporarily setting the laptop to sync, the files from last year have downloaded surplanting the ones created this year which are now marked as conflicted. i.e., the incorrect identification of files as being conflicted isn't a problem of just one computer, but both my PC and LT.

I'm impressed that your system apparently synced the .pdf files to the cloud in the short interval between creation and being populated. I'm still wating for the test files I created on both PC and LT to replicate your test in posting 13. I am monitoring the syncing process to pause/stop before serious damage occurs!

Re: BT Cloud Windows Client version 21.8.9

RTL — Mon, 22 Nov 2021 19:24:38 GMT

@henryfm

"Then you show that BT Cloud has synchronised the same file to DT A, DT C and LT. Just as it should be - but wait. What's happened to the older versions of Test_Sync? When BT Cloud downloaded the latest version to a client, has it deleted the old version and replaced it by the new? "

That seems to be what is happening.

"Maybe the old versions are available on the BT Cloud web"

Definitely not. Even checked the Dustbin.

For my files I don't normally use Save. If I was going to change the file data, I open it up and at the end do a Save As with that days date. For instance, I have just loaded Fish Tank Maintenance 15th November---entered the data for today and then saved the file as Fish Tank Maintenance 22nd November. In this way the "old file" is retained. Every so often I'll delete some of them--but they would still be in the Cloud Dustbin if I needed to retrieve one.

Re: BT Cloud Windows Client version 21.8.9

henryfm — Tue, 23 Nov 2021 00:41:59 GMT

@RTL @PaddyB

Ah, we start to see an explanation for our different experiences. Basically, to create Conflicted files, you need 2 or more versions of a file with the same name. If it's a spreadsheet file, you need to be using Save rather than Save As and giving a new name. So your normal usage is not at risk of creating Conflicted files. It's difficult to understand why your Test_sync file has not created Conflicted files, whether correct (old version) or incorrect (new one) as BT Cloud seems to want to do at present. Are you forcing up/down-load or just letting Sync do so in its own time? Are other versions present on BT Cloud web as previous versions of the files synced to DT A, DT C and LT?

I admit that I usually use Save for my spreadsheet files. Maybe I should use Save As, but if you have a reliable online backup system (whether pure backup or a sync sytem) it should not be necessary. In particular, if I'm using sync and want to open the file on the other PC, I don't want to have to check what timestamped name is current; I just want to open the file. But then there is a risk of Conflicted files. No problem if the system is working correctly, i.e. the newest version is the active version. Big problem if the active version is set in aspic, the current version when BT Cloud 21.8.9 was activated.

For spreadsheet or word processing documents, your routine using Save As and time-stamping could work. It does NOT work for other utilities. Thus, for my Access database tasks, the core file gets updated every time a record is added or changed. The file itself is not saved afresh when Access is changed, only modified but of course its modified date is updated. So BT Cloud should synchronise the Access files, marking the OLD version as a Conflicted file, not the NEW version. The problem with V21.8.9 is that an old version of the file can now be downloaded as the active version with Sync being used effectively as a backup for one PC.

The example cited in Posting 5 relates to my web page. During the year, building up to and reporting results after the prestigeous Round Rotherham event I create information about the event, and afterwards various results pages. Necessarily, I have a set of standard web pages that I edit, save and upload to the web site host. Pages are of course linked so not only do I keep the same file names (by using Save), I have annual subfolders in which there are standard file names, year after year. Changing a file name would involve a tedious and error-prone task of changing links in other web page files. Standard file names apply for .htm and also some .pdf files. The current misbehavoiur of BT Cloud means I have to be careful to ensure that last year's results don't get uploaded to this year!

I still await (a) my PC and LT getting round to uploading (as the first step in synchronising) my test files, as mentioned in Posting 14 - the log files show that BT Cloud loves to check and recheck ancient files rather than looking at recent creations to see if they need to be synced - and (b) the promised return phone consultation with Stephen from BT Cloud support to provide my supporting evidence from the .log files