This topic

Can I request ducted install rather than overhead from pole?

Pearly_King — Tue, 04 Apr 2023 17:54:37 GMT

I live in a stone built house in a rural area.

My current copper line runs down a pole at the boundary of my property and through the garden. The copper was replaced about 5yrs ago and was not laid in a duct.
Can I request that the new fibre connection running between poles follows the same or similar route through the garden or will I have to accept a fifer cable slung from the pole and running down the outside of my home?

Re: Can I request ducted install rather than overhead from pole?

licquorice — Tue, 04 Apr 2023 18:14:37 GMT

This is a BT retail forum, you would need to ask Openreach that question and the answer will be unique to your situation, there is no generic answer.

Re: Can I request ducted install rather than overhead from pole?

pippincp — Tue, 04 Apr 2023 20:23:48 GMT

How do you know it will be supplied overhead? Use the BTWholesale checker to find out if WBC FTTP is available. The notes below the table will show how it will be supplied according to the survey.

Anecdotally a change to what the survey has indicated will be chargable. Your case may be different though.

Re: Can I request ducted install rather than overhead from pole?

iniltous — Tue, 04 Apr 2023 20:41:57 GMT

As a general rule , if there is an overhead method of provision, then that’s what you will get , if your property has a DIG ( direct in ground ) copper cable from the pole that could also provide the same service via overhead, then presumably at some point the underground option was requested by the householder at the time , who either paid a premium for getting an underground cable provided ( instead of overhead ) or possibly after requesting BT visit , had the cable delivered by BT and they installed the BT supplied cable themselves, and all BT did was connect it once it was installed in the ground, but I suspect this would have been before Openreach existed, when these type of arrangements were negotiable, as the consumer dealt directly with the network provider , now ( thanks to Ofcom ) the network provider is Openreach, and you would speak to BT .

Can you request an underground cable from the outset , if the address is surveyed as ‘overhead’ ?, No , can you , once service is installed ask for a change from overhead to underground, possibly , there is this option for copper service , if it is available for FTTP , it would be at your expense, and chances are , it would need a paid for survey initially, so you pay for a survey regardless of wether you proceed or not , once you know the costs of providing an underground feed.

Re: Can I request ducted install rather than overhead from pole?

Pearly_King — Wed, 05 Apr 2023 08:08:18 GMT

Many thanks for the replies.

The copper underground cable from pole to dwelling was replaced through BT approximately 5yrs ago as the copper wires were breaking down. Several attempts had been made over the years to move from one set of paired wires to another but eventually there were no serviceable wires left.

the replacement cable was laid through the garden and across a gravel drive but was laid VERY shallow and not in a duct. As a result I fear the overhead option would be used to install FTTP.

I am in Northern Ireland and despite having no fibre option at my rural location up until now I now have both Openreach and Fibrus cables running past the property overhead on the same telegraph poles. Fibrus appear to have no difficulty providing a ducted through the ground install but I haven’t as yet had an indication whether that would be the case through Openreach.

Thanks once again for the responses

Re: Can I request ducted install rather than overhead from pole?

pippincp — Wed, 05 Apr 2023 09:47:47 GMT

@Pearly_King See post 3.

Re: Can I request ducted install rather than overhead from pole?

Pearly_King — Wed, 05 Apr 2023 10:32:54 GMT

Thanks pippincp,

The BT Wholesale site is showing that FTTP is not currently available. The fibre cables were installed on poles in the autumn of 2022 under a rural gigabit voucher scheme and I have separately confirmed with openreachthat this is now live. BT and Openreach keep sending me fliers in the mail saying that fibre to the premises is now available and indeed the literature indicates that I am now obliged to place a order as I pledged gigabit voucher under the rural community scheme. At the same time a second scheme also installed fibre in the same area meaning I now have a choice of supplier.

Both Fibrus and Openreach are now actively competing for new fibre customers.

Re: Can I request ducted install rather than overhead from pole?

iniltous — Wed, 05 Apr 2023 11:33:04 GMT

If Fibrus say they will provide a ducted feed from the pole , I would be surprised if they actually follow through with this , if you place your order with them and it’s a deal breaker if they don’t supply your service underground I would ask for some confirmation in writing, but this is a BT forum, discussion of that ISP isn’t appropriate.

If a voucher system was used to leverage a FTTP build somewhere that wasn’t commercially viable otherwise , it makes no sense that you have two networks to chose from , as they both cannot have used the promise of using the vouchers to part pay for the build, whichever network provider only built in your location on the basis of DCMS vouchers ( or whatever the NI equivalent is ) should be the network supplier used , the other network, presumably ( and bizarrely ) decided to build in an area that already had a publicly subsidised network in the offing and that they will receive no subsidy for ( unless NI has a different policy to England )

Re: Can I request ducted install rather than overhead from pole?

Pearly_King — Fri, 25 Aug 2023 06:30:28 GMT

I know this is an old question but I have a solution that might help someone else having the same situation.

My underground unducted copper line has now faulted. A trace and repair team found the fault and we’re about to excavate and fix it. However, fibre to the premises is now available and they suggested processing a fault to repair order be placed meaning a new fibre install would be actioned instead of a repair to the old line.

I explained why I had been holding off going for fibre as I didn’t want an overhead cable to my house and then clipped vertically down the front elevation. No problem they said, we’ll install a sub duct through the lawn and follow the same route as the UG copper and then enter the premises at the original location. Apparently, in my case, this will be every bit as easy as the overhead option. Everyone happy and finally after todays install I can ditch my 4Mb copper connection and join the information superhighway at up to 900mb!

i trust this may give hope to anyone else avoiding a fibre upgrade due to overhead install

Re: Can I request ducted install rather than overhead from pole?

iniltous — Fri, 25 Aug 2023 08:41:06 GMT

So did your address have an underground service area but is in a primarily overhead service area ?,
if an address or an area is served underground but with direct in the ground DIG cables , then any designed OR FTTP service will almost certainly also be underground, generally OR don’t put up poles where no poles previously existed.
If your current service is underground, unless you are in the unusual situation of your neighbours are all overhead and serviced with overhead dropwires , but your properties copper pair isn’t overhead but was individually provided with underground DIG , and that copper pair is now faulty , then even if FTTP wasn’t available, the repair would involve providing a ducted feed , so it makes sense to change to FTTP at the same time if FTTP is available, but it’s not going to be a particularly common situation, generally areas are overhead , underground DIG or underground ducted , there will be some that are on the boundary between these types of services, but are relatively few and far between.

In the OP case they were served from a pole , but instead of overhead from the pole the cable went underground, if FTTP were available in that situation, and overhead were the simplest option it would be taken, any deviation ( like putting the fibre underground ) wouldn’t be done for free, you don’t say if a pole was ever a possibility for your provide , and what’s more there is no indication that the OP copper service is in any way faulty.

Re: Can I request ducted install rather than overhead from pole?

Pearly_King — Fri, 25 Aug 2023 08:44:32 GMT

I live in a rural area served by poles to the boundary. The existing copper service was an armoured cable that ran down the nearest pole and was laid just below ground level (50mm or so) along a hedge line then turned 90 degrees opposite the front door then continued under a gravel drive to the front elevation. No ducting was installed when that UG cable was last replaced c10-12yrs ago.

that cable has now faulted once more and Openreach have agreed to install Fibre To The Premises using the same underground round but using a technique described as sub ducting. It’s a very small diameter duct and looks like a plastic heating pipe, around 15mm diameter.

Overhead fibre was installed to the poles past my property almost a year ago but I have been trying to decide the best route as I don’t like cables running vertically down the outside of the building, which would be the case in an overhead install from the pole