This topic

Fibre Routing into house

Colin_London — Fri, 01 Dec 2023 01:27:25 GMT

Currently have an overhead copper dropwire connection and SoGEA (digital voice, no POTS). New fibre DP just installed on our pole so should be able to order FTTP within 2 weeks.

The route into our hall via the porch extension is a bit tortuous with several turns and especially the hole through the original front door frame which was very tricky to drill when they had to replace the drop wire into the house a few years back.

I would like the fibre to be installed via the same route but this would:

1) require the engineer to remove the copper cable completely (not a technical issue as I no longer have a POTS telephone).

2) potentially have too many turns for a fibre.

What is the bending radius on the fibre cable between the external joint box that is installed on the outside wall and the ONT?
Will the engineer have enough time to rip out the old copper cable from the pole and master socket before installing the new fibre equipment? I ask as I think normally it is left behind…

Apparently this is not a ‘fibre priority’ exchange area.

Re: Fibre Routing into house

36ULW — Fri, 01 Dec 2023 06:14:06 GMT

The bend radius of the Inside - Out Cable Openreach use is that of a £2 Coin.

Ref to how many bends it can have, I don’t think there is a limit. When I did installs we were never told there was one but then I guess when you’re doing an an install and are limited to no more than 10m of cable internally they probably aren’t expecting multiple bends in the fibre.

As to the removal of the old copper line, to be honest both Openreach Engineers and their Contractors usually leave them in situ, purely because they don’t have the time to recover them but they may if it helps running the new Fibre Cable.

Re: Fibre Routing into house

Colin_London — Fri, 01 Dec 2023 08:23:48 GMT

This is what I assumed - that they leave the old copper cable to save time. However as I say because of the porch this is the only route into the hallway where the existing master socket and power is located.

Well I supposed they could drill through TWO walls (the porch and the house whilst trying to avoid the soil down pipe) but that route would look horrendous and have to cross roof tiles.

Can I warn Openreach that the old route needs reusing before they turn up?

Re: Fibre Routing into house

36ULW — Fri, 01 Dec 2023 08:34:27 GMT

‘Can I warn Openreach that the old route needs reusing before they turn up?’

No, not really. You could phone your chosen SP and ask them to put said note on the order. Whether that filters down the the Engineer and if he/she even bothers to read it is another thing.

Notes between SP’s and Openreach were never any good at working. After all these years they still can’t get theirs, Openreach’s and the multiple systems in between to work together.

I used to show up on site and a Sub would ask, ‘Did you get the note?’.

I’d then show them my phone and ask, ‘You mean this note’

Please can Engineer let #%{]=}}^]%]=]}#* 43/}+#^{%]+{+#*}^[]{##]]]}#%{[]=#^#*]*{*]]{#^}^{%{^{ #+}^]%]^{{{{{{{

Re: Fibre Routing into house

iniltous — Fri, 01 Dec 2023 08:37:12 GMT

There isn’t a maximum number of bends , provided the bend radius is observed, the actual number of bends is irrelevant, provided the light level received at the ONT is sufficient then these things are not really a concern, right angle bends ( for example ) would be avoided, as stated , imagine a cable laid around the edge of a £2 coin is how ‘tight’ a bend can be .
There isn’t really a way to forewarn OR , but if your address have indicated to have issues at survey , it could already be KCI2 ( 2 stage install ) , for example if your existing dropwire attachment is above
a flat garage roof , but generally the installation people will try and accommodate what you want ( if it’s reasonable ) if what they propose isn’t acceptable to you , the installation doesn’t proceed, obviously removing the copper wire , means no way to maintain what you have .

Re: Fibre Routing into house

Colin_London — Fri, 01 Dec 2023 11:27:32 GMT

Obviously if I’m asking the engineer to use the existing cable holes then I’m going to want a commitment from them that they can complete the job in one go - being left without service is not going to be acceptable.

Looking at the houses in my street that got fibre (some over a year ago now) most now have two drop wires from the pole to the house so it seems the standard approach is to leave all the old copper in-situ to rot away.

Re: Fibre Routing into house

iniltous — Fri, 01 Dec 2023 11:43:17 GMT

That’s why it’s important to discuss your requirements with the installer , there were a couple of cases ( on this forum or a similar one ) where ( presumably with the householder permission ) in one case the existing copper cable was used as a draw rope to pull the new optical cable into the duct , ( this is obviously an underground feed ) , the cable broke leaving the customer without either service, and another ( even more unfathomable ) where the ‘installer’ recovered the copper ‘line’ , only to discover there was no optical network in the area .

The new optical cable usually follows the same route from pole to house ( using the existing attachment at the house end ) from there , it’s not necessary to follow the same route , if ( for example ) someone had the copper pair master socket in a bedroom, but wanted the ONT in a downstairs room , that’s fine …taking the old dropwire down should also be OK provided it’s accessible during the FTTP installation, if the copper dropwire is from a different pole to the where the optical drop is from ( not very common) they may not climb both poles , it should be the case, with Alt Nets , that the copper dropwire is left in place because it’s not their property to interfere with , they put their own cable up , that’s all .

Re: Fibre Routing into house

pippincp — Fri, 01 Dec 2023 16:51:08 GMT

Worth remembering the siting of the ONT does not need to be where the master socket is.

Re: Fibre Routing into house

WSH — Fri, 01 Dec 2023 17:23:33 GMT

Also worth noting your router can be connected to the ONT by up to 100m of cat 5e cable, so it can be in a different room.

Re: Fibre Routing into house

36ULW — Fri, 01 Dec 2023 22:21:30 GMT

The reason some homes have a second drop cable for FTTP is DV wasn’t available at the time so they retained the copper for their phone service.

It could also be the FTTP Technology available in your area is BFT, Blown Fibre Tubing. Again with this you had to retain the Copper Line if keeping a traditional land line.

Or it could just be the Engineer(s) who did the install just didn’t have time to recover the old copper drop wire.

Re: Fibre Routing into house

Colin_London — Sun, 03 Dec 2023 14:51:37 GMT

The reason some homes have a second drop cable for FTTP is DV wasn’t available at the time so they retained the copper for their phone service.
It could also be the FTTP Technology available in your area is BFT, Blown Fibre Tubing. Again with this you had to retain the Copper Line if keeping a traditional land line.
Or it could just be the Engineer(s) who did the install just didn’t have time to recover the old copper drop wire.

Possibly, but I am on DV already so have no need to keep the old copper line.

This area isn't BFT - it is pulled fibre cable in the old ducts to the poles.

I suspect it will be time. Hence my question.

Re: Fibre Routing into house

Colin_London — Sun, 03 Dec 2023 15:00:40 GMT

Also worth noting your router can be connected to the ONT by up to 100m of cat 5e cable, so it can be in a different room.

Given my house hasn't got ready made trunking to run ethernet cabling around it, that is not going to help.

The current hub location is the perfect location in my property. No going to be pressured into putting it somewhere else just because it takes 30 minutes off the installers job.