This topic

Duct Blocking Method Used by Openreach for FTTP Installations

luhkomo — Thu, 02 May 2024 16:07:03 GMT

Hi all, I'm not sure if this is the right place to ask, but it's about my current BT Fibre installation.

I have an FTTP service via BT/Openreach, where the fibre enters my home vertically through the floor of a cupboard on the ground floor. A fibre engineer recently showed me that this duct is obstructed by a "bag" filled with a substance that hardens, which is used to prevent gas, moisture, and other elements from entering the property.

Does anyone know what is it called, and is it standard practice for Openreach installations? Is it removable/replaceable?

Re: Duct Blocking Method Used by Openreach for FTTP Installations

tonysmini018 — Thu, 02 May 2024 16:11:26 GMT

Yes it is the standard duct seal method, and they can be removed and replaced if needed.

Re: Duct Blocking Method Used by Openreach for FTTP Installations

iniltous — Thu, 02 May 2024 16:14:45 GMT

Its a duct seal ( inflated bag ) , it’s filled with air , obviously to introduce a new cable the bag is removed, and replaced after the new cable is installed, it is to stop gas/water entering via the duct , in most domestic situations this isnt needed as the duct is external not internal, your image suggests it’s a business setting where the duct is within the building itself …..there are other methods of sealing ducts , but that looks like the inflated bag type .

Re: Duct Blocking Method Used by Openreach for FTTP Installations

luhkomo — Thu, 02 May 2024 16:26:31 GMT

Thanks for the responses, I'm trying to educate myself a little.

The duct is located under the stairs of my house, built around 2014. A fibre engineer assessed the possibility of running another fibre through it but claimed that the seal used is difficult to remove, and they lack the equipment to reseal it. I was sceptical. He proposed an alternative of branching off the existing duct and running along the exterior wall, which I'd prefer to avoid for aesthetic reasons!

Re: Duct Blocking Method Used by Openreach for FTTP Installations

iniltous — Thu, 02 May 2024 18:19:21 GMT

Pretty unusual to have an internal duct entry on a domestic SDU ( single dwelling unit ) , not so much on a MDU , it doesn’t surprise that service delivery technicians won’t have the necessary equipment but should ( hopefully ) be able to borrow it from a colleague that deals with these situations, certainly before assuming that the duct needs to be intercepted outside and a new duct exit provided on the outside of the building, it’s not clear from the photo but is the duct approximately 2inch or 4inch , a 4inch duct ( duct 54 ) is common in business not in residential

Re: Duct Blocking Method Used by Openreach for FTTP Installations

36ULW — Thu, 02 May 2024 18:26:35 GMT

Have you already got Fibre of some kind?

That Black Cable with a Yellow Stripe looks like a COF215 Cable.

Fibre Cables usually have a Yellow Stripe to identify themselves as Fibre.

Ref to the Duct Seal Bag, just needs popping with a knife, getting it out, especially when it’s stuffed that far down the Duct is another story as on the outside is a Sticky gel tape that is an absolute b*****d to get off.

Re: Duct Blocking Method Used by Openreach for FTTP Installations

licquorice — Thu, 02 May 2024 19:25:54 GMT

@iniltous I believe internal duct entry is common practice in NI

Re: Duct Blocking Method Used by Openreach for FTTP Installations

pippincp — Thu, 02 May 2024 20:24:12 GMT

@licquoricewrote:
@iniltousI believe internal duct entry is common practice in NI

Correct.

Re: Duct Blocking Method Used by Openreach for FTTP Installations

luhkomo — Thu, 02 May 2024 20:43:49 GMT

> before assuming that the duct needs to be intercepted outside and a new duct exit provided on the outside of the building

This is what I was thinking. Apparently the 'civil' guys are going to come and take a look. Hopefully they'll just get what they need to get the new fibre alongside my existing one! I really don't want something going up the wall on the outside, but we'll see if I can convince them haha.

> is the duct approximately 2inch or 4inch

Thanks for the info! Looks to be ~2 inch

> Have you already got Fibre of some kind?

Yep, I have FTTP via BT/OpenReach. I have another provider who use OpenReach's ducting through the street. I won't go into details as this is a BT forum!

> I believe internal duct entry is common practice in NI

FYI I'm in England in a Taylor Wimpey built house.

Re: Duct Blocking Method Used by Openreach for FTTP Installations

licquorice — Thu, 02 May 2024 20:44:49 GMT

Hmm, then that is very unusual

Re: Duct Blocking Method Used by Openreach for FTTP Installations

36ULW — Thu, 02 May 2024 20:46:26 GMT

It’s soon going to become common in all New Build Homes in the U.K.

Well, sort of.

Openreach are trialling a CSP that built into a mini footway box within the Boundary for the Subs premises.

From there they’ll be a Duct that then goes directly into the property.

As said, it’s in Trial Phase at the minute but I’d imagine Openreach will press ahead with it.

Re: Duct Blocking Method Used by Openreach for FTTP Installations

licquorice — Thu, 02 May 2024 20:58:24 GMT

Interesting

Re: Duct Blocking Method Used by Openreach for FTTP Installations

iniltous — Thu, 02 May 2024 22:03:34 GMT

I didn’t read the original post sufficiently well to appreciate that it’s not Openreach that are confused by the duct seal but some alternative network person and it’s the alternative network that have no way to replace it should they remove it , be interesting if they screwed up and flooded the building or worse caused an explosion ( although very unlikely) by not re sealing a duct correctly, I wonder who would be liable in these circumstances ? , and in a similar vein , I very much doubt an alternative network should be smashing their way into an a Openreach duct that in all likelihood is not blocked , to divert it to another location, just because they are unable to reseal duct entry , if they hit a duct blockage and repaired that damage , thats one thing ( allowable under PIA ) , but to divert the duct elsewhere is something else , sounds like this Alt Net should be riding around on horses and wear Stetson’s and spurs .

Re: Duct Blocking Method Used by Openreach for FTTP Installations

luhkomo — Thu, 02 May 2024 23:05:10 GMT

> I didn’t read the original post sufficiently well to appreciate that it’s not Openreach

Yeah, sorry, that may have been my mistake to be honest. I was trying to avoid talking about other networks on a BT forum and focus on trying to understand the OpenReach installation. I wasn't sure if i was being fobbed off.

> I very much doubt an alternative network should be smashing their way into an a Openreach duct that in all likelihood is not blocked

This is what I was thinking too. It all feels very odd. I asked them when they were going around setting up a few months back and they said they have some arrangement with OpenReach to use their pits (not sure if that's the right term) and ducting between.

I know you're not suggesting I do, but I'm not going to try and police them on touching OR stuff, but I'm going to make it clear that I want them to put it up the existing ducting and reseal rather than digging all over the place and drilling holes in my wall. If they're not willing to accommodate that, or give me a good reason why, I'll likely just withdraw from the whole thing.

Re: Duct Blocking Method Used by Openreach for FTTP Installations

iniltous — Fri, 03 May 2024 06:48:56 GMT

Alternative Networks ( you don’t want to name the one in question , but City Fibre , Netomnia , BRSK to name three , but there are dozens of then ) are allowed under PIA ( physical infrastructure access ) to use Openreach poles , ducts and jointboxes ( what you called pits ) , they pay a peppercorn rent to use space on or in these assets , but obviously shouldn’t damage these assets in the process of using them.

FWIW , the solution to them not having the necessary equipment to seal the existing duct , is not your preferred one , but also not what they proposed, they should provide their own new duct from the Openreach jointbox to your building , not divert the existing Openreach one ( by doing so , they interfere with Openreach’s own use of the duct )

It’s not your preferred solution , but it’s the only appropriate one if they cannot seal the existing duct , which is not exactly rocket science