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Current telephone cable is DIG grey armour cable , How "should" fibre be supplied?

justjohn1 — Mon, 24 Feb 2025 10:52:45 GMT

Current telephone cable is DIG grey armour cable , How "should" fibre be supplied?

No duct currently. Grey armour cable is burried in ground aprox 55ish metres along drive from a pole. BT broadband Availability checker info below.(we have never used the current copper line)

Featured Products Downstream Line Rate(Mbps) Upstream Line Rate (Mbps) Downstream Range (Mbps) Availability Date FTTP Install ProcessWBC FTTP

Up to 1000

Up to 220

Available

1 Stage

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Available

Our records show the following FTTP network service information for these premises:-Single Dwelling Unit Residential OH Feed with no anticipated issues.

Re: Current telephone cable is DIG grey armour cable , How "should" fibre be supplied?

licquorice — Mon, 24 Feb 2025 11:02:34 GMT

A duct will be provided

Re: Current telephone cable is DIG grey armour cable , How "should" fibre be supplied?

justjohn1 — Mon, 24 Feb 2025 11:13:18 GMT

Installation is due on 26th. We are concerned they will want to force us to have an overhead wire from pole.

They have just sent below e-mail.

Key things to know:

On the day, before we start the work, we'll agree with you how to get a new line into your premises. A decision maker aged 18+ will need to be present throughout the appointment as we may need to ask questions on the day.
We'll drill a small hole through the wall to connect the Fibre cable, we may also need to drill a couple of extra holes to safely attach our ladder, but don't worry we'll restore these before we finish. If you don't own the property, you'll need to ensure you have the owner or landlord's permission for this work.
To help us work safely on the day, please move any furniture from the area and ensure pets are kept away until the installation is complete (even if they're friendly).
In most cases your engineer will have your service up and running within 3 hours of their arrival. If they arrive towards the end of the appointment slot, you'll need to be there until the work has been completed.
We're taking extra steps to protect vulnerable households who use personal health devices (known as telecare) as these may not be compatible with the digital landline service on your new service. If you think you may have a health device connected to your current landline, firstly contact your broadband provider to tell them, and then contact your health device provider to let them know you are being moved to a digital voice service and request a replacement device if one is required. Find out more here Protecting customers during the migration to digital landlines - Ofcom"

Re: Current telephone cable is DIG grey armour cable , How "should" fibre be supplied?

licquorice — Mon, 24 Feb 2025 11:23:11 GMT

As stated in point 1, Openreach (not BT) will decide how to provide the cable.

Just re-read the notes on your original post, it would appear Openreach are expecting to provide your service from a pole.

You made no mention in your original post that there were overhead feeds in the vicinity.

Re: Current telephone cable is DIG grey armour cable , How "should" fibre be supplied?

justjohn1 — Mon, 24 Feb 2025 11:27:45 GMT

My concern is openreach will decide to go overhead even though previous install was UG/DIG.

I dont believe there is an openreach forum , so have come here to see if i can gain any insight regarding the procedure.

Re: Current telephone cable is DIG grey armour cable , How "should" fibre be supplied?

licquorice — Mon, 24 Feb 2025 11:31:32 GMT

Nobody here can predict what Openreach will decide, it is unique to your situation.

What is your objection to an overhead feed?

Re: Current telephone cable is DIG grey armour cable , How "should" fibre be supplied?

iniltous — Mon, 24 Feb 2025 11:56:52 GMT

If the SNN ( survey network note ) is for your address, it clearly shows ‘Overhead’ .

Single Dwelling Unit Residential OH Feed with no anticipated issues.

Your cautious language regarding Openreach not having a forum to ask questions, suggests it isn’t BT that you have used to provide service but some other ISP , if that’s the case you are in the wrong place , your questions are nothing to do with BT .

FYI , it’s irrelevant if the previous copper pair service was underground via a buried armoured cable, there is no compulsion for Openreach to stay underground, ( although they usually do ) but if there is an overhead solution OR can and do use that , you can get a property on the boundary between an underground DIG ‘estate’ and an older ‘overhead’ served area , so a DIG property could be served overhead in a small number of cases , the majority of the DIG properties won’t show availability, just those that can ‘see’ the pole originally designed to serve older properties.

OR have the option to put up new poles in DIG areas ( same as some alternative networks do ) as a cost effective solution to DIG areas , but I’d suggest in your case there was already a pole existing and your underground service was something of an anomaly, there is the option ( that the customer pays for ) to transfer overhead to underground service, it’s possible that your underground service was because a previous occupant paid to have an underground service when the overhead service was the default, or you address has access to overhead as it’s close by this overhead network ….obviously if you want an underground service and are prepared to pay to get that , it’s an option, but a potentially very expensive one.

You definitely won’t get OR to provide underground service for ‘free’ if an overhead option is available, if overhead isn’t acceptable, your order will be cancelled.

Re: Current telephone cable is DIG grey armour cable , How "should" fibre be supplied?

licquorice — Mon, 24 Feb 2025 11:35:03 GMT

One thing is certain, if you do persuade Openreach to provide an underground feed, it won't happen on the 26th

Re: Current telephone cable is DIG grey armour cable , How "should" fibre be supplied?

justjohn1 — Mon, 24 Feb 2025 11:54:37 GMT

Its a new BT contract.

The cable if it comes from the pole will run over head up my drive eg.aprox 50m over head along the centre of my drive.

House was built around 12 years ago. unsure who laid the cables down the garden or if the owners paid extra for it to be done.

I was unsure if it was classed as an upgrade or whether they we obliged to use the same method as old cables for the fibre install.

Re: Current telephone cable is DIG grey armour cable , How "should" fibre be supplied?

iniltous — Mon, 24 Feb 2025 11:52:58 GMT

Often the reason posters on here don’t specify BT as their provider is because they have used someone else , if you have used BT for your order , that fine .

Re: Current telephone cable is DIG grey armour cable , How "should" fibre be supplied?

iniltous — Mon, 24 Feb 2025 12:12:24 GMT

It’s not uncommon for a property that’s built much later than those properties that surround it , to be served differently, however , in your case it undoubtedly was a choice the builder/developer made to have an underground service, probably a purely aesthetic decision , but as they undertook the work to bury the cable from the property wall to the curtilage of the site , chances are its was cost neutral to BT/OR ( depending on who was the network provider back then ) so was no problem connecting the the address to the copper network this way .

The fact is that now ,underground isn’t going to be cost neutral, it would be massively more expensive to install underground when the overhead option exists , therefore FTTP service is going to be overhead ,it even states as much with the SNN for the address .

TBH , if that is not going to be acceptable, you may as well cancel now , rather than sending the technician away on the day of the visit.

Re: Current telephone cable is DIG grey armour cable , How "should" fibre be supplied?

justjohn1 — Mon, 24 Feb 2025 12:52:08 GMT

The current pole at the end of our drive was probably put in for just for this house, we are very rural.

Its an openreach branded adsl/ telephone outlet.

Re: Current telephone cable is DIG grey armour cable , How "should" fibre be supplied?

pddco — Mon, 24 Feb 2025 22:08:03 GMT

Just wondering, I take it you’re sure it’s armoured cable and not a smaller diameter cable in a microduct? I’ve read elsewhere that one or two homeowners have mistaken such armoured cable. But anyway, just a thought.

Re: Current telephone cable is DIG grey armour cable , How "should" fibre be supplied?

iniltous — Mon, 24 Feb 2025 22:14:52 GMT

DIG , or a cable in duct 100 wouldn’t alter the fact that the survey has indicated overhead means of provision, so should an order be made the technician that turns up will be ‘primed’ for an overhead feed , not an underground one…..should the homeowner refuse the overhead installation, protesting that the existing copper cable is underground so won’t accept anything other than underground , it won’t make any difference, the tech returns the incomplete job as installation refused by the customer , and the order is cancelled.

Re: Current telephone cable is DIG grey armour cable , How "should" fibre be supplied?

justjohn1 — Mon, 24 Feb 2025 22:50:23 GMT

Its defo armour cable. i am hoping if they are unable to run ducting , they will at least install a second pole. A second pole would avoid running down my drive with overhead cables.

Re: Current telephone cable is DIG grey armour cable , How "should" fibre be supplied?

pddco — Mon, 24 Feb 2025 23:13:43 GMT

@iniltous Can see why @justjohn1 would be a bit miffed having an OH feed albeit at height down the middle of the drive. And can see the very black and white approach that OR may take. But surely through BT who, I would hope value their customer, there may be room for manoeuvre. At least have an opportunity to speak to an OR survey person about other options. Couldn’t a second pole be put nearer the house perhaps taking the feed away from the drive? Even if it meant a contribution from the customer perhaps? Think that’s what I’d be looking for. That OH feed would there a long time and personally I’d want to thoroughly explore all options before excepting the default not pretty solution.

Re: Current telephone cable is DIG grey armour cable , How "should" fibre be supplied?

iniltous — Tue, 25 Feb 2025 09:44:13 GMT

If there is no reason to provide a second pole (other than aesthetics ) then one won’t be provided….50m isn’t a long span , so the only reason to add another pole would be if the minimum height over the driveway couldn’t be maintained, this may be the case is if the property were a single storey building like a bungalow , then arguably it requires standing a new pole next to the property and erecting a wire between the existing pole and new pole on the way to the building itself, this can be more intrusive visually.

This post has really gone on a flight of fancy, apparently there is a pole capable of delivering service with ‘no anticipated issues’ , that’s really it , knowing this , the OP orders service on that basis or doesn’t , no underground service ( unless the customer wants to pay ) and no extra pole unless it’s necessary.

Re: Current telephone cable is DIG grey armour cable , How "should" fibre be supplied?

justjohn1 — Tue, 25 Feb 2025 09:48:35 GMT

i don't mind paying a reasonable fee.

what is minimium hight and also distance from detached buildings?

The line will come past a garage and the house is lower than the pole. The single line will cross my drive twice as there is a curve and gradient.

Re: Current telephone cable is DIG grey armour cable , How "should" fibre be supplied?

pddco — Tue, 25 Feb 2025 10:24:57 GMT

@iniltous .. So if it were your property you’d be happy with that then? And not try to see what was possible? I appreciate you’re putting the hard business approach to it all. And no doubt it’s all technically correct. But annoyingly people and feelings do tend to get in the way.. Yes appreciate some people do try to get something for nothing and expect OR to do stuff that wouldn’t make business sense. But clearly the OP cares about the look and may be prepared to explore other ways of sorting it..

Re: Current telephone cable is DIG grey armour cable , How "should" fibre be supplied?

iniltous — Tue, 25 Feb 2025 11:20:36 GMT

It’s not really to do with being ‘happy’ , it’s unrealistic expectations, if you went to Tesco to buy ‘mince’ you don’t expect them to provide you with steak for the same price , or expect a car manufacturer to supply a limousine for the price of a city car , why expect Openreach to spend thousands on an install getting nothing extra from the ISP compared to the standard installation method.

….as I’ve stated , if the standard method of provision is unacceptable then a paid for bespoke installation can be arranged, unfortunately because the majority would baulk at the cost , most ISP are not interested and likely be unaware how to even arrange that , given the regulatory requirements that the network provider doesn’t ‘liaise’ with the consumer , the consumer can’t contact Openreach directly about this , even if a customer is prepared to pay , initially for a survey to establish the likely costs , getting your ISP to engage with this may prove problematic.

If the OP preferred method is underground and is prepared to pay for that extra work , generally the way is to get overhead installed first and then request via the ISP , an overhead to underground shift , this requires a knowledgeable ISP , most are ‘stack it high , sell it cheap’ providers and will simply say it’s not possible…..the process is a paid for survey ( non refundable in the event that the quote is unacceptable ) , should an acceptable quote/solution be agreed, payment is made in advance ( via the ISP , hence the need to get a service in first ) and the work proceeds , the survey cost are deducted from the construction costs