This topic

Legitimate emails 'lost' by BT server

Cougar_Kid — Tue, 09 Jul 2024 20:16:05 GMT

To my mind, the problem that I am having with BT's Email handlers renders their email system UNUSABLE. Unfortunately, my BT email address is very much ingrained into my life, and I would much rather get the issue fixed, rather than run away from it. There are two aspects to the issue:

I cannot rely on messages that I send out to long-standing and legitimate email addresses being posted on to the intended recipient with 100% certainty. I only have one such recipient that I can prove with 100% certainty, but then I don't know what I don't know, and there may be more! They just get totally 'vaporised' without any warning message to me or to the intended recipient - not branded as SPAM, not sent to 'Junk', just totally vanish!
I cannot rely on legitimate messages sent to me reaching me with 100% certainty either! I had a run-in with BT on this particular aspect in the Summer of 2023, when I suddenly stopped receiving very important emails from a Club; other members of the Club continued to receive them, and I only found out about the problem by chance. I was in a position to trace those messages, and their path ended abruptly at the BT Email server. Not in Spam, not anywhere, just 'vaporised', as I describe it. BT fobbed me off with platitudes about 'protecting the safety of their customers' and they just would not accept that if their checking algorithms had any doubts about the message, then they should modify the Subject line with a warning, and send it either to my Inbox or to Spam - AND MOST CERTAINLY NOT just make it totally disappear without trace.

In addition to the issues above, an important message that our Health Centre sent to my wife completely vanished before it reached her, and just today I actually watched someone send me an emailed receipt / confirmation of a booking that I had just made / paid for, and that email has also vanished without trace!

I cannot think that I am such an odd case that I am alone in suffering from these problems. I thought I'd ask whether anyone else on this forum is aware that they are affected? I am so annoyed with this matter that if BT cannot be persuaded to change their practice, then I am minded to bring it to the attention of every TV and Radio Consumer Programme that I can think of.

Re: Legitimate emails 'lost' by BT server

Junepw — Wed, 10 Jul 2024 09:52:38 GMT

I have also lost emails, 4 that I know of in the last month. With my husband we have 3 email addresses and all of them are affected. They are all local to our address and one is from a local bank. As it happens, we are moving house and the other 3 missing emails are quotes from removal companies. I tried BT email technical help but after an hour and a half the problem is not solved. I am so frustrated by this and will look at other options once we have moved house. Sorry I can't offer a solution but I wanted to let you know you are not the only one in this situation.

Re: Legitimate emails 'lost' by BT server

Cougar_Kid — Wed, 10 Jul 2024 10:29:17 GMT

Thank you! I suspected that I couldn't possibly be alone, and now you have confirmed it! I think that I will start phasing out my dependence on BT Internet emails unless their Technical team decides to take notice of our complaints by changing its filtering algorithms and practices. I am not asking much of them - just send messages they don't like the look of to SPAM, rather than into oblivion.

Re: Legitimate emails 'lost' by BT server

imjolly — Wed, 10 Jul 2024 10:39:53 GMT

@Cougar_Kid

did you read this posts about problems and fixes done or still to be done https://community.bt.com/t5/Email/BT-Webmail-Feedback-v2-post-16th-April-release/td-p/2376642

why don't you put the problem emails in safe contacts

Re: Legitimate emails 'lost' by BT server

Junepw — Wed, 10 Jul 2024 10:55:57 GMT

Thanks for the link - I'll try it. I couldn't put the contacts in 'safe contacts' because I haven't had any emails from them previously so don't have their addresses.

Re: Legitimate emails 'lost' by BT server

Cougar_Kid — Wed, 10 Jul 2024 15:33:53 GMT

Hello

Thank you for your comments - but they don't get anywhere near answering my problem.

The link that you kindly provided focusses on what are essentially cosmetic attributes of the webmail service: my problem is at a deeper level, and involves the algorithm that the BT Email service uses to inspect and route messages that pass through it. Incoming messages should either be sent to my inbox, or, if the algorithm thinks the message is dubious, to Spam. My problem relates to messages that don't go to either of those destinations - they vanish completely. I know how to mark messages as 'Not Spam and Safe Sender' - but of course I can only do that if I find them in Spam. If they have completely vanished then normally I have no alert to that fact. "I do not know what I do not know."

Both the Club messages that I referred to and the friend who suddenly stopped being able to send or receive emails to / from me were already registered as 'Safe Senders' when these incidents suddenly arose. For my friend, I have simply given up using BT Internet emails, and I use my 'gmail' account instead. No problems since I changed to that practice. For the important Club messages, I did get some pointers from the BT Technical Team that the messages were failing to reach me because the Email Service that the Club used - one that is widely used by Bridge Clubs throughout the UK and some in the wider world - had been listed on the Invaluement international list of blocked domains. I took it upon myself to contact Invaluement directly, with sufficient supporting evidence to persuade them to de-list it. As soon as that was achieved, the messages from that Club flowed to me freely through the BT Email Server.

My primary point is that it shouldn't matter whether or not messages come from a 'listed' domain. If BT want to raise red flags by sending it to SPAM then at least I have an alert that I can act on. I have ZERO confidence that all sorts of other important emails that have been directed to - or, indeed, from - me are not being subjected to the same action, and finished up in oblivion. "I do not know what I do not know."

Re: Legitimate emails 'lost' by BT server

licquorice — Wed, 10 Jul 2024 16:12:47 GMT

The BT spam filters categorise mail in one of three ways. Mail they consider ok goes to the Inbox, dubious mail goes to the Spam folder and anything they decide is definitely spam is rejected at the server. If the latter were not the case, your Spam folder would be inundated with thousands of spam mails daily.

Unfortunately, the BT spam algorithms are not the best and quite often the baby gets thrown out with the bathwater.

This has been the case for a long time and I despair that they can't get it right when others seem to be able to do so.

I have long since used Gmail for any important emails.

Re: Legitimate emails 'lost' by BT server

Cougar_Kid — Wed, 10 Jul 2024 16:37:33 GMT

Well that is very clear! Thank you!

Do you not have problems using gmail for Banks, Credit Cards, etc: they seem to want an email address that can be tied to a real and verifiable street address? Mind you, as far as I know, I have never had issues with messages from such institutions coming to my BT Internet email address. As far as I know........

Re: Legitimate emails 'lost' by BT server

licquorice — Wed, 10 Jul 2024 16:53:41 GMT

No, but I can't see how a bank or any other institution can tie an email address to a physical address, that's entirely impossible.

Re: Legitimate emails 'lost' by BT server

gg30340 — Wed, 10 Jul 2024 17:07:58 GMT

@Cougar_Kid wrote:

Well that is very clear! Thank you!

Do you not have problems using gmail for Banks, Credit Cards, etc: they seem to want an email address that can be tied to a real and verifiable street address? Mind you, as far as I know, I have never had issues with messages from such institutions coming to my BT Internet email address. As far as I know........

How can a bank want an email address to be tied to a verifiable street address. How would they know the email address was tied to that address.

To open a bank account, you need to provide proof of your identity and address. This can include a recent utility bill, council tax bill, rental or mortgage contract, bank statement, or a benefits or state pension letter.

There is no requirement to provide an email address. Not everybody has one.

For online only banks you require the above and an email address but there is no requirement to prove it is tied to the street address. How could it be proved.

Re: Legitimate emails 'lost' by BT server

Cougar_Kid — Thu, 11 Jul 2024 10:30:26 GMT

This thread has gone a bit 'off subject', but, for example, a BT Internet email address has an air of credibility: if the user is a BT Customer, then they must have a legitimate street address . On the other hand, someone using, say, a Gmail address, could be anybody, anywhere. I think it was on the Money Savings Expert website where I read that Financial Institutions tend to frown upon such email addresses, especially in the context of anti-money laundering regulations. It makes perfect sense to me.

Re: Legitimate emails 'lost' by BT server

gg30340 — Thu, 11 Jul 2024 10:36:00 GMT

It might make sense but there is no requirement.

You can have a BT email address and the leave BT retaining the email address as a free BTMail Basic email account. Then move house to a new address and not notify BT.

There is no way to tie an email address to a fixed street address.

Do you think the millions of gmail email account holders don't have a bank account?

Re: Legitimate emails 'lost' by BT server

Cougar_Kid — Thu, 11 Jul 2024 10:48:14 GMT

OK - you win. It's not the point of my thread.

Re: Legitimate emails 'lost' by BT server

Cougar_Kid — Tue, 03 Sep 2024 10:41:26 GMT

With respect, when I set up my gmail address I was not asked anything as to who I was, and, indeed, to offer any tangible evidence that I existed at all.

When a Bank / Financial Institution see that a potential new customer has a 'tied' email address - of which BT Internet is merely an example - they have confidence that the individual is someone who uses BT Communication services, which are always tied to a specific physical address. Never mind which address, it is an address that is in receipt of BT Services. I read that Credit Agencies use such thinking when calculating Credit Scores, for example.

Anyway, those points are entirely irrelevant. What I wanted to know was, primarily, whether any other BT email users have experienced what I refer to as 'vaporised' emails, and secondly whether there is any way that the BT Technical people could for once listen to their customers and respond by stopping the practice of 'vaporising' messages. The clear answer that I have from this Community to my first point is "Yes", and to my second point is "No". In other words, I should vote with my feet.........

Re: Legitimate emails 'lost' by BT server

gg30340 — Tue, 03 Sep 2024 11:59:20 GMT

As you for what ever reason have again raised the point about "tied" email addresses after two months absence I note you never mentioned anything about my question

"Do you think the millions of gmail email account holders don't have a bank account?"

nor have you covered the part about people no longer being a BT customer yet still retaining a free BTMail Basic email account and possibly having moved home address numerous times applying for a bank account.

In any event I agree it is off topic and I really do not need or want an answer to the above.

Re: Legitimate emails 'lost' by BT server

rogerdee — Fri, 06 Sep 2024 20:41:45 GMT

I have similar issues with gMail - it all depends on where the origin of the email is from, the content and a number of other variables.

I'd email the support team with some examples - I am sure they will look into it.

BT are not providing a rubbish email service - and certainly not just making emails vanish - or their call centre would be swamped - not something they would want.