This topic

Update firmware on Hubs used as repeaters

andihawes — Sun, 21 Jan 2024 13:31:15 GMT

Dear Forum.

i have a SH2 as my main 'gateway' router and then 3 other SH2 and 1 HH4 as repeaters wired in.

Do the repeaters, both SH2 and HH4, update themselves with firmware if in this config?

How would i do this if not?

PS: i cant find the firmware version on the HH4 anywhere?!?! Where would it be?

Re: Update firmware on Hubs used as repeaters

Anonymous — Sun, 21 Jan 2024 13:55:56 GMT

Seems a totally bonkers setup but that's your choice.

Updates are "pushed" to the Hubs & I believe only the one connected directly to the Internet would update. There's no manual update facility so the only option would be to rotate them, with all the pain of reconfiguring that would entail.

Re: Update firmware on Hubs used as repeaters

WSH — Sun, 21 Jan 2024 15:34:50 GMT

No, they only update when plugged in as the router and it can’t be done manually. I was once sent a second HH5 by mistake. They never ask for it back, so I used one as a wireless access point and one as a router, rotating to keep them up to date. I ended up doing that for a couple of years in fact.

With the SH2 allowing the config to be exported you could set up two different profiles, reimporting the role as necessary. As the things auto reboot every 14 days anyway, rotating them might not be that much work but as rbz5416 says, with the price of repeaters these days there are easier ways of doing it especially if you want to rotate four of them.

Re: Update firmware on Hubs used as repeaters

Edinburgh-wg — Sun, 21 Jan 2024 15:39:55 GMT

@Anonymous Bonkers or not, if it works for them, that's great.

Re: Update firmware on Hubs used as repeaters

WSH — Sun, 21 Jan 2024 15:54:32 GMT

Well, what helped in the HH5 days was that the updates were less frequent than today. I’ve just looked up the recent updates for the SH2. To give you some idea of the frequency:

v0.37.00.07084-BT Jul'22
v0.38.00.20147-BT Feb'23
v0.39.01.04077-BT Jun'23
v0.40.00.04147-BT Aug'23
v0.41.00.07076-BT Nov'23
v0.41.01.10137-BT Dec'23

I'm not sure I'd fancy doing it today.

Re: Update firmware on Hubs used as repeaters

spile — Mon, 22 Jan 2024 07:28:59 GMT

Using a router as a repurposed wireless point makes sense as a cost effective option.

Re: Update firmware on Hubs used as repeaters

andihawes — Mon, 22 Jan 2024 22:15:21 GMT

it works anddoesnt cause any issues, with my limited knowledge of these things.

In a perfect world, what is the perfect set up with a wired house and needing 5 wifi points in totlal, 1 being 100m from the house?

Re: Update firmware on Hubs used as repeaters

andihawes — Mon, 22 Jan 2024 22:20:18 GMT

hmmm, does sound like a bit of a job to update them all....

Re: Update firmware on Hubs used as repeaters

licquorice — Tue, 23 Jan 2024 08:07:08 GMT

Why do you need to update them? If they are working leave well alone.

Re: Update firmware on Hubs used as repeaters

Anonymous — Tue, 23 Jan 2024 08:59:31 GMT

@andihaweswrote:
In a perfect world, what is the perfect set up with a wired house and needing 5 wifi points in total, 1 being 100m from the house?

Probably a mesh system. A decent system would possibly allow a reduction in the number too, as the WiFi in the SH2 doesn't have a great rep. But we'd really need to know more about the property size, construction & your usage. I cover a three bed, brick walled semi with a couple of TP-Link Deco units.

My take on using old routers as APs is that it made sense years ago, when domestic mesh systems were pretty much non-existent. But now it's a bit like an Evri driver using the family Fiesta to deliver parcels. It gets the job done after a fashion but the correct tool would be a van.

But as others have alluded to, if it works for you...

Re: Update firmware on Hubs used as repeaters

andihawes — Mon, 29 Jan 2024 10:40:00 GMT

i have a large 5 bed house, 3 story [ground/1st/2nd], Studio in garden 100m away.

3 routers cover ground floor including access point, basically each end and middle. The middle didn’t reach either end hence why they got put in. Groudn flooe Access Point is in my office.

1 in 2nd floor games room which facilitates bedrooms on 1st floor as well as games room. 1 in Studio 100m away with a armoured cable running down to studio.

House was built in 2021, standard brick construction with some internal walls brick and other partitions.

Since putting this in, I use heavy data for work, some times 2 machines, kids have xBoxes and PSs, computers, iPads, 4 TVs with apps on which get used for streaming, etc, never had a single network issue.

im technically minded but not specifically networks like this, I can configure my own routers but thats as far as it goes. I dont understand if wifi cant reach a corner of the house, how would a mesh network reach it? As the house is fully cabled, why wouldn’t I use the cable? I have lots of wifi networks over the years and all fail miserably on heavy data usage, games machines stall, TVs would stutter on streaming.

Would/Could you add a WiFi Disc Repeater, I think these are ‘092822’ as these have a network port, instead? I havent used these. Do they auto install onto your network or would I have to configure it?

Re: Update firmware on Hubs used as repeaters

andihawes — Mon, 29 Jan 2024 10:44:06 GMT

i have 4 SH2 and 1 HH4. the HH4 sis in the Studio 100ms away [cabled to same network] and gives odd behaviour on my wife’s MacBook Pro, but only hers, and not mine, nor any Apple phones.

Her MBP needs to come back to house network to connect, then walking it back down to the studio the HH4 works.

DHCP is off on the HH4 which i believe is correct as the Office SH2 [access point] is the only router with DCHP on.

Maybe i need to update that HH4 to SH2? Or dependant on other answers her, a Wifi Mesh Repeater Disc?

Re: Update firmware on Hubs used as repeaters

Anonymous — Mon, 29 Jan 2024 11:32:02 GMT

Long story short, your current setup is a series of standalone access points. Repeaters are much the same but slower, so no surprise they didn't work well. In a mesh system every access point can talk to every other access point within range & so has a better chance of finding a clear path back to the primary router. Although in your case that is taken care of by the ethernet connection. We also need to be mindful that current fibre board may be foil backed to aid insulation. That will kill WiFi between rooms.

Each SH will be double-NAT'ing, something gamers apparently hate.

A current mesh system could use WiF 6, 6e or even the newest 7, whereas the BT kit is stuck at WiFi 5. I would also expect a dedicated mesh to have far superior WiFi coverage to a SH2. But that would need some trial & error to find out how many access points you could get away with. But this all comes at a cost.

So again, it's not how I would have done it but if it ain't broke...

Re: Update firmware on Hubs used as repeaters

licquorice — Mon, 29 Jan 2024 11:35:28 GMT

@Anonymous The hubs won't be double natting if connected LAN to LAN as access points.

@andihawes As far as I'm aware, the HH4 is only a single band (2.4Ghz) device.

Re: Update firmware on Hubs used as repeaters

Keith_Beddoe — Mon, 29 Jan 2024 11:54:36 GMT

@licquorice

The HH4 is dual band.

Re: Update firmware on Hubs used as repeaters

countrypaul — Mon, 29 Jan 2024 11:56:48 GMT

@Anonymous from the OP description other than the primary SH2 connected to the Internet the other hubs are being used only as ethernet switches and access points so no double NAT-ing.

If there is significant data transfer between various pieces of kit within the house then having a wired network would leave more bandwidth on the WiFi network which of course is shared and can be prone to interference from other sources.

I have gone the same way with 2 older routers use to provide WiFi in places that cannot be reached from the Internet connected router - two layers of aluminium foil due to insulation and just distance/walls for the other. All rooms have CAT6 so all desktop PCs, Xbox, RPi/3Dprinter, TV, Firestick, Hue Hub, etc. are on Ethernet. That still leaves many things on WiFi such as Echos, Mobie Phones, WiFi switches, iPads, Kindles, ASHP etc.

In our case the limit is VDSL but that is a consequence of preferring not to live in a city.

Re: Update firmware on Hubs used as repeaters

WSH — Mon, 29 Jan 2024 12:23:58 GMT

@andihawes

“I have lots of wifi networks over the years and all fail miserably on heavy data usage, games machines stall, TVs would stutter on streaming”. Not at all surprising.

If you have a fully wired house, why use Wi-Fi at all? Wired connections are much better for heavy use. They are more reliable, more secure and nearly always faster. (To be fair, they have made tremendous improvements on the speed -side with wireless over the last ten years).

My own house was wired by myself and I rarely use a wireless access point. I only usually put one on if I need to connect the phone etc. and even then, it’s only a spare SH2. All the serious hardware is wired.

@rbz5416 I would be surprised if there is any NAT involved in using it just as an access point?

Re: Update firmware on Hubs used as repeaters

Anonymous — Mon, 29 Jan 2024 12:42:58 GMT

@WSH, @licquorice & @countrypaul

I stand corrected on the NAT front! 🙃

Re: Update firmware on Hubs used as repeaters

andihawes — Mon, 29 Jan 2024 14:20:49 GMT

for clarity, anything that can have a cable connection does so now.... Games Machines, TVs, my work laptops in the office, etc. Its only mobile devices which get to use WIFI, plus laptops moving around the house.

Re: Update firmware on Hubs used as repeaters

andihawes — Mon, 29 Jan 2024 14:22:38 GMT

so single/dual.... which ever a HH4 is... could that affect my wifes MacBook Pro, 2 years old, once a sleep and wakes, needs to come back to the house network to get a signal. If not it picks up an odd IP address which isnt an IP we use.

Ifi replace this, should i replacw with a SH2? or Wifi Disc? other?