This topic

Changing router (yet again)

ShedDriver — Mon, 15 Apr 2024 08:40:54 GMT

I am trying to replace my SH2. I have set the username to bthomehub@btbroadband.com and password to BT, as posted on multiple threads. (Interestingly the SH2 lists the password as 'not required')

But the new router does not connect. It tries and I see various handshaking taking place. I've used all the obvious stuff, PPPOE etc. etc. Is there something unusual that BT use?

Re: Changing router (yet again)

Keith_Beddoe — Mon, 15 Apr 2024 08:44:39 GMT

Perhaps your router is incompatible with your broadband service?

What type of broadband connection do you have, and what speed are you supposed to get?

Re: Changing router (yet again)

ShedDriver — Mon, 15 Apr 2024 08:46:46 GMT

Sorry that should be PPPOA before anybody jumps on it.

Re: Changing router (yet again)

Anonymous — Mon, 15 Apr 2024 09:07:19 GMT

You haven't told us what service you have, what router you're trying to configure or how it's connected. If you answer all three then maybe someone can help.

Re: Changing router (yet again)

ShedDriver — Mon, 15 Apr 2024 09:10:45 GMT

Service is VDSL (fibre to box, not home)

I expect about 55 MBs

Router is a Draytek Vigor 2850

Re: Changing router (yet again)

Anonymous — Mon, 15 Apr 2024 09:34:39 GMT

Guess we'll have to make do with two out of three.

The configuration s PPPoE not PPPoA.

Password isn't required on the BT Hubs but is provided because some third party routers won't allow a blank entry.

I'm assuming that as this router is apparently over 10 years old, that it's used. Are you using the VDSL cable that came with it or the one from the SH2? If the latter, swap it over. Also factory reset the router.

Re: Changing router (yet again)

ShedDriver — Mon, 15 Apr 2024 09:39:03 GMT

Thanks, PPPOE it is.

The router does accept a null password, but warns me. Fair enough. I got the password as BT from here, Draytek FAQs seem to think it should be password. Does BT quietly ignore the password?

I appreciate the Draytek is old, but it is a VDSL router and should be able to handle this.

As for cabling, I am pulling the connection from the SH2 (which works) and putting it into the Draytek.

Sorry for delays, obviously I have to wait for the SH2 to sort itself out again before I can read further posts.

Re: Changing router (yet again)

Anonymous — Mon, 15 Apr 2024 09:43:16 GMT

@ShedDriverwrote:
As for cabling, I am pulling the connection from the SH2 (which works) and putting it into the Draytek.

Then as I said, try the one that came with the Draytek. They are not necessarily interchangeable.

Google suggest you may also need to set a VLAN tag of 101:

You'll find the VLAN setting on WAN\General Setup\WAN1: set VLAN Tag insertion (VDSL) to 'enable' and enter a Tag Value of 101.

Re: Changing router (yet again)

Keith_Beddoe — Mon, 15 Apr 2024 09:43:41 GMT

Use the one that came with the Draytek, the pin assignments are probably different.

Re: Changing router (yet again)

ShedDriver — Mon, 15 Apr 2024 10:32:38 GMT

VLAN made no difference, I tried with priority 0 and 1

Using a Draytek cable could be a problem, I have no idea where the original is. As you know the SH2 has a RG45 sort of socket, with 4 pins, only the centre pair connected - as has been used on phones for years (at least since the demise of the ring line from the master socket). However the Draytek is aware that it is connected to a signal of some sort, as it goes into a handshaking mode.

I'll try with a different router, but that may be a few days, and let you know.

Re: Changing router (yet again)

WSH — Mon, 15 Apr 2024 10:42:15 GMT

“As for cabling, I am pulling the connection from the SH2 (which works) and putting it into the Draytek”.

I have a 2762 configured this way:

The SH2 needs to be directly connected to the master socket for digital voice.

Smart Hub 2 (SH2) router settings:

DHCP off. (The addresses here are best set as static addresses).

Router itself set to a static IP of 192.168.1.254, (the default).

Subnet mask of 255.255.255.0 or /24, (also the default).

DMZ host set to 192.168.1.2 (This helps with double NAT problems or at least it takes care of the port forwarding on the SH2. There is still address translation happening, however, so you may still have problems with multiplayer games, UPnP etc. In fact, you only really need this if you have incoming external connections to a server etc. Personally, I’ve never found double NAT to be an issue and I don’t use the DMZ host setting. Note, if you do use it, this setting allows a lot of traffic to effectively bypass the SH2 firewall, so you are relying on your own router’s firewall for security, just as if it was directly connected to the internet).

Turn off both Wi-Fi bands in favour of your own router. (This may also be a good security move if you do enable the DMZ host. I would still expect Wi-Fi traffic on the SH2 to go through its firewall but I can’t be sure how they’ve set it up internally).

Connect the DSL port to the phone socket on the wall.

DV phone/extension then plugs into the phone socket on the Smart Hub 2.

Draytek settings:

DHCP on, range 192.168.0.2-192.168.0.200 (Note the 0 in the third position, making this a separate network to the SH2. This is deliberate, not a typo).

Router itself is on a static IP of 192.168.0.1

Subnet mask of 255.255.255.0 or /24

Enable the EWAN port and set it to a fixed IP of 192.168.1.2, (so it is part of the SH2 network).

Gateway set to 192.168.1.254, (again, pointing to the SH2).

DNS set to 192.168.1.254 (or whatever you usually use).

The EWAN socket on your own router (probably 4) connects to a LAN port on the SH2. (NB. This will not work if you use the DSL port on your own router).

(If you want IPv6 the easiest way is to set the SH2 to DHCP Stateless and make the Draytek a DHCPv6 client then bridge across to LAN1 with the firewall on).

Re: Changing router (yet again)

Keith_Beddoe — Mon, 15 Apr 2024 10:42:50 GMT

An older router is unlikely to perform any better than the Smart Hub 2.

Re: Changing router (yet again)

WSH — Mon, 15 Apr 2024 10:57:13 GMT

@Keith_Beddoe

True. Any connection is only ever going to be as fast as the slowest link.

In my case the SH2 is only there for the DV. The Draytek is what controls access to and manages my network.

Re: Changing router (yet again)

ShedDriver — Mon, 15 Apr 2024 11:18:10 GMT

Hi WSH, I think from your description you are using a Draytek as a firewall only, I was hoping to use it to connect directly.

I don't expect to get a performance increase, what I am really after is a far more comprehensive flexible routing. In fact I would be happy with a dial-up rate as long as it was on 100% of the time, unlike BT which drops out at the most inconvenient times. I am hoping to tack on a 4G router to solve that problem. Most Draytek routers (even the prehistoric ones!) have an ethernet WAN input in addition to the VDSL.

I miss the days when the first email from an ISP was a list of connection settings

As I said, I will post when I get some closure on this, but it may be a few days.

Re: Changing router (yet again)

naylor2006 — Mon, 15 Apr 2024 11:27:24 GMT

To clarify, you are wanting to connect your own 3rd party router directly to the master socket right?

This generally is preferable so you arent double NAT'ing....but in alot of case folks are leaving the ISP router in the mix.

Re: Changing router (yet again)

WSH — Mon, 15 Apr 2024 11:41:15 GMT

No, the Draytek does the routing for my network but the incoming connection comes via the SH2, so it can do DV.

You stated “As for cabling, I am pulling the connection from the SH2 (which works) and putting it into the Draytek”. I assumed that meant you were passing traffic from the SH2 to the Draytek. If you are using the Draytek in place of the SH2 then none of what I said is relevant.

It's been a while since I've used the Draytek directly but my notes suggest:

VDSL2, Service VLAN tag 101, Priority 0
Username: bthomehub@btbroadband.com
Password anything
PPP Detect
Authentication: PAP/CHAP/MSCHAPv2
IPv6: PPP

Draytek's own knowledgebase is very helpful on BT set ups. I suggest you look there if you are still having problems.

Re: Changing router (yet again)

ShedDriver — Mon, 15 Apr 2024 12:08:02 GMT

Yes Naylor, exactly. An even more extreme solution would be to use a bridge, like a Draytek 130, and have an even more under control box to do the VDSL authorization stuff.
WSH, it seems like I have these settings, further fault finding is required.

Re: Changing router (yet again)

WSH — Mon, 15 Apr 2024 12:15:59 GMT

Fair enough. I can't find the 2850 but you might find this useful anyway:

https://www.draytek.co.uk/support/guides/vigor-2860-vdsl-setup

I'm off out, so I'll leave you to it.

Re: Changing router (yet again)

naylor2006 — Mon, 15 Apr 2024 12:35:51 GMT

On my ER-X I can look at the PPPOE logs in the CLI, does the Draytek have an terminal you can SSH into?

Its possible on my router to see the CHAP PPPOE handshake take place or view any errors should they arise. Loooooooads of people use these Draytek models to connect directly to the socket or ONT if its FTTP so you shouldnt be having any wild issues. For example here are my successful logs

show interfaces pppoe pppoe0 log Mon Mar 25 15:43:58 GMT 2024: PPP interface pppoe0 created Mon Mar 25 15:44:01 GMT 2024: Stopping PPP daemon for pppoe0 Mon Mar 25 15:44:02 GMT 2024: Starting PPP daemon for pppoe0 Connected to REMOVED via interface eth0 using channel 1 Renamed interface ppp0 to pppoe0 Using interface pppoe0 Connect: pppoe0 <--> eth0 sent [LCP ConfReq id=0x1 <mru 1492> <magic REMOVED>] rcvd [LCP ConfReq id=0xe0 <mru 1492> <auth chap MD5> <magic REMOVED>] sent [LCP ConfAck id=0xe0 <mru 1492> <auth chap MD5> <magic REMOVED>] rcvd [LCP ConfAck id=0x1 <mru 1492> <magic REMOVED>] sent [LCP EchoReq id=0x0 magic=REMOVED] rcvd [CHAP Challenge id=0x1 <REMOVED>, name = "acc-aln2.agz"] sent [CHAP Response id=0x1 <REMOVED>, name = "bthomehub@btbroadband.com"] rcvd [LCP EchoRep id=0x0 magic=REMOVED] rcvd [CHAP Success id=0x1 "CHAP authentication success"] CHAP authentication succeeded: CHAP authentication success CHAP authentication succeeded peer from calling number AA:BB:CC:DD:EE:FF authorized sent [IPCP ConfReq id=0x1 <addr 0.0.0.0> <ms-dns1 0.0.0.0> <ms-dns2 0.0.0.0>] rcvd [IPV6CP ConfReq id=0x4f <addr REMOVED>] Unsupported protocol 'IPv6 Control Protocol' (0x8057) received sent [LCP ProtRej id=0x2 REMOVED] rcvd [IPCP ConfReq id=0x67 <addr 172.16.15.197>] sent [IPCP ConfAck id=0x67 <addr 172.16.15.197>] rcvd [IPCP ConfNak id=0x1 <addr REMOVED> <ms-dns1 REMOVED> <ms-dns2 REMOVED>] sent [IPCP ConfReq id=0x2 <addr REMOVED> <ms-dns1 REMOVED> <ms-dns2 REMOVED>] rcvd [IPV6CP TermReq id=0x50] Unsupported protocol 'IPv6 Control Protocol' (0x8057) received sent [LCP ProtRej id=0x3 REMOVED] rcvd [IPCP ConfAck id=0x2 <addr REMOVED> <ms-dns1 REMOVED> <ms-dns2 REMOVED>] Script /etc/ppp/ip-pre-up started (pid 2785) Script /etc/ppp/ip-pre-up finished (pid 2785), status = 0x0 local IP address REMOVED remote IP address 172.16.15.197 primary DNS address REMOVED secondary DNS address REMOVED Script /etc/ppp/ip-up started (pid 2850) rcvd [IPV6CP TermReq id=0x51] Unsupported protocol 'IPv6 Control Protocol' (0x8057) received sent [LCP ProtRej id=0x4 REMOVED] Script /etc/ppp/ip-up finished (pid 2850), status = 0x0

Im rushing a little bit so I just REMOVED anything which I thought I should.....but my point is hopefully you can get at a verbose output somewhere and establish some sort of issue because there is quite a bit going on.

Maybe if you have a config you are attached to back it up, factory reset the router and just go through the PPPOE wizard or initial setup if there is one.

Re: Changing router (yet again)

Anonymous — Mon, 15 Apr 2024 13:00:58 GMT

@ShedDriverwrote:
However the Draytek is aware that it is connected to a signal of some sort, as it goes into a handshaking mode.

Have you tried with the cable removed to see if it behave differently? If it does then unlikely to be the cable, but it also might be too dumb & try to connect regardless.