This topic

issue controlling BTTV STB over hdmi

markthom — Wed, 10 Jan 2024 18:39:35 GMT

Hi, i have an LG G3 Evo TV & BT STB (DTR-4000) and a HDMI between the two, my aim is to use the LG remote to control both devices, in the main that works except for recording on the STB.

firstly Simplink/CEC on the TV is on & from my LG remote i can control the STB volume, move up/down channels, flick between guide, menu, channel etc. all the things you can do with the BT remote…..but i cannot find a way to “record” - all the buttons available to me on the LG remote do not start a recording on the STB.

after much investigation & help on some LG forums i am leaning towards the issue being BT locking down the capability to instigate a recording control/action from a hdmi connected device, i.e. only allowing it from the remote (IR / bluetooth).

has anyone any thoughts or experience.

thanks, Mark.

Re: issue controlling BTTV STB over hdmi

Midnight_Voice — Wed, 10 Jan 2024 21:39:30 GMT

Hi @markthom

I have an LG GX (2020) with a magic remote, and I can control what you can control, mostly via the menu that comes up when I press … on the magic remote, where Home and Menu seem to map to the blue Y button on the YouView remote. And I can’t find Record either.

But I never thought of this as going over the HDMI; I always thought of it as the magic remote sending the YouView, or whatever other device the magic remote covers, IR codes.

One pointer to this is that the magic remote thinks it can control a Roku Streaming Stick+, but it can’t, because this uses a proprietary wireless protocol, not IR. But it can perfectly well control a Roku Express, which uses IR (except I have never got it to match * on the Roku remote, but that’s a different story),

Whereas as these two Roku devices have the same HDMI interface, then if HDMI was involved, the magic remote could work both devices equally well.

As a test (which I’ve just thought of, but haven’t tried) turn off CEC on the G3 (you may have to turn off ARC as well, to stop this turning CEC back on) and see if the magic remote still works the YouView box as far as it did before. If it does, then the magic remote clearly isn’t using CEC.

I see no great conspiracy here, though. Just that LG haven’t mapped Record onto a remote button or … command, just like they haven’t mapped * onto a remote button when using Roku. Though I will check for this on the … menu tomorrow; it might be there, with luck.

Re: issue controlling BTTV STB over hdmi

markthom — Thu, 11 Jan 2024 09:23:02 GMT

@Midnight_Voice I am not sure that understanding is 100% correct, here's why.

when I setup my HDMI connected STB on the LG UI it prompts me to select the service provider/device type etc & then runs thru some connectivity tests, i.e. it presents a button on screen called PR & you click on it to see if the STB channel changes, you can cover the LG remote with your hand & it still works, you can run the same test when it is all setup, as you describe bring up the LG menu for controlling the STB, obscure the line of sight between LG remote & TV/STB and select the menu pause or guide button, the STB will still respond, so it cannot be IR as the primary method.

I tried what you suggested & turned off CEC on the LG TV but still the STB controls (not record) worked from the LG remote/menu, that was confusing, but then I read this article below, basically I read that CEC is an optional standard that can be implemented and exactly what features each vendor implements is again different (hence me thinking BT have not chosen "record") but more importantly HDMI does not Defacto need CEC to manage devices, its just not quite as level a playing field if it is not.

https://source.android.com/docs/devices/tv/hdmi-cec

also, I believe the LG remote uses HDMI/CEC & also IR, in the case above it is HDMI but if you place your phone camera in front of the remote, spin the camera to front facing & press one of the LG remote buttons you will see the IR being transmitted.

Re: issue controlling BTTV STB over hdmi

Anonymous — Thu, 11 Jan 2024 09:35:16 GMT

Have you tried the learning function to teach the LG from the BT remote?

Re: issue controlling BTTV STB over hdmi

dephead2004 — Thu, 11 Jan 2024 10:39:57 GMT

Not possible on the new BT/EE remote. Apparently only possible on the old style remote

Re: issue controlling BTTV STB over hdmi

Anonymous — Thu, 11 Jan 2024 10:48:30 GMT

@dephead2004

I think you've misunderstood. Firstly @markthom doesn't have the Pro Box & secondly, I'm referencing the learning function of the LG remote.

Re: issue controlling BTTV STB over hdmi

dephead2004 — Thu, 11 Jan 2024 11:17:58 GMT

Ah Yes. I have an HDMI issue and so jumped to a wrong conclusion. Sorry

Re: issue controlling BTTV STB over hdmi

markthom — Thu, 11 Jan 2024 11:26:53 GMT

i haven’t tried that, didn’t know it was possible, i’ve had a quick look’s for some info but nothing obvious, do you have a link to instructions.

mine isn’t the newest BT remote, it’s a few years old & controls my BT dre-4000 STB.

Mark.

Re: issue controlling BTTV STB over hdmi

markthom — Thu, 11 Jan 2024 11:52:42 GMT

sorry that was to @Anonymous

Re: issue controlling BTTV STB over hdmi

Anonymous — Thu, 11 Jan 2024 11:57:43 GMT

Sorry, Google was being **bleep** again in returning a result for another product!

Re: issue controlling BTTV STB over hdmi

markthom — Thu, 11 Jan 2024 15:48:42 GMT

what I ideally need is someone with a different STB to the one provided by BT, possibly freeview etc. that is connected to an LG tv and can verify that they “can” record on that STB using the LG remote, i.e. there is an extra option available in the menu or the red button works.

Mark.

Re: issue controlling BTTV STB over hdmi

Midnight_Voice — Thu, 11 Jan 2024 17:56:24 GMT

@markthom wrote:

@Midnight_Voice

I am not sure that understanding is 100% correct, here's why.

> If you cover the end of the remote comprehensively enough, nothing gets through, for either controlling the TV or the STB. Which is a DTR-T4000 in my downstairs setup.

> The same hand-covering on the remote for my Roku Streaming Stick+ has no effect whatever, on most commands, as this is an RF device. Though it does stop On/Off and Volume +/-, which are IR commands.

I tried what you suggested & turned off CEC on the LG TV but still the STB controls (not record) worked from the LG remote/menu, that was confusing,

> It’s only confusing if you think CEC is involved.

but then I read this article below, basically I read that CEC is an optional standard that can be implemented and exactly what features each vendor implements is again different (hence me thinking BT have not chosen "record") but more importantly HDMI does not Defacto need CEC to manage devices, its just not quite as level a playing field if it is not.

https://source.android.com/docs/devices/tv/hdmi-cec

> Yes, but there are no Android devices involved here.

> Yes, always, as the magic remote has no wireless capability. I did wonder, though, if maybe the items you could only work via the … button were coming over HDMI-CEC. But even these still work if CEC is off.

(Newly added)

I'm aware you have a G3, with a newer remote than my GX, so I wondered if this explained anything. So I looked at our bedroom C2, which has the new remote, and the Universal Control a little more automated than the GX. But you can insist on setting up Universal Control manually, so I tried this on the C2 with our upstairs YouView box, a DTR-T2110, and during the setup I got this screen (which I can also get on the GX, but I think it’s more indicative on this later TV):-

You will notice that it says to point the remote at the device. Significantly, not at the TV.

Which I can bear out for my BluRay player, some way below the TV and in a glass-fronted cabinet, set back so so popping the tray out doesn’t hit the glass, which require pretty precise aiming of its own remote, let alone the LG one.

(Sorry the formatting here is a bit messy, it’s defying all my attempts to fix it. How do I get at the raw HTML, or can’t I? 😢)

Re: issue controlling BTTV STB over hdmi

markthom — Thu, 11 Jan 2024 18:02:22 GMT

i have been thru that screen trying different device types, i think it’s probably the wording when it states “point at the device” & most likely means the TV, i’ll show you why.

when you click on the “next” button you will end up on the screen i have attached, it requires you to point the magic remote at the TV & specifically point the cursor over the PR button to check the STB channel changes when you push the LG OK wheel, so basically it’s impossible to point the remote at a different device to the TV.

hope that makes sense.

Re: issue controlling BTTV STB over hdmi

Ric81 — Thu, 11 Jan 2024 18:12:38 GMT

For what it’s worth i use the BT TV Box Pro with the Lg G3 Oled and I also have been unable to find a way of recording on the BT box using the LG magic remote.

it’s been only a minor niggle for me as I don’t tend to record that much but it does seem strange that the functionality isn’t there.

Re: issue controlling BTTV STB over hdmi

markthom — Thu, 11 Jan 2024 18:23:52 GMT

same here, it’s not a biggie but it’s got me investigative juices flowing 😰

i’ll make sure i post back anything i find as i also have a thread running on an LG AV forum 👍🏻

Mark.

Re: issue controlling BTTV STB over hdmi

Midnight_Voice — Thu, 11 Jan 2024 19:42:49 GMT

@markthom

Mine jumps through that screen without stopping - I had to take a video and look at the exact frame to see it, I expect that’s why they talk about 1 metre and facing the same way.

My puzzle at the moment then, is what PR 🔺means, and what proper operation of it might show? Programme Up 1? So BBC1 becomes BBC2, and so on?

Re: issue controlling BTTV STB over hdmi

markthom — Thu, 11 Jan 2024 19:42:46 GMT

PR is programme button, you click that and the channel changes.

thats my understanding.

Re: issue controlling BTTV STB over hdmi

markthom — Thu, 11 Jan 2024 19:48:57 GMT

& yours will be skipping thru because you are selecting the default setup it provides you which i can see is BT TV (South) - under manage settings delete that & select view all, you can select what you want there event down to choosing “Humax” etc. & then you will have loads of tests/profile to go thru.

mark.

Re: issue controlling BTTV STB over hdmi

Midnight_Voice — Thu, 11 Jan 2024 19:57:40 GMT

@markthom

OK, next test. Cover the YouView box so its remote can no longer operate it. (Quite tricky, took me two bath towels).

Now try to operate it from the LG remote, which you think will receive the commands on the TV, and then pass them via HDMI/CEC to the YouView box, and so should still work it. But nothing happens. Why do you think that is?

On my theory, it’s simple; the covered YouView box can’t see the LG remote either. But what’s your explanation?

Re: issue controlling BTTV STB over hdmi

markthom — Thu, 11 Jan 2024 20:27:18 GMT

we must have very different environments, i get the same results i posted a little earlier in this thread, nothing as exotic as towels over the STB but simply place my hand (or an object) in front of the LG remote, the magic pointer still moves (as you would expect as this is bluetooth) & when i select inputs / hdmi & the “…” button i can still control the STB & i still have the remote IR sensor covered.

i then took a step backward & deleted my LG hdmi profile & started again, i.e choosing BTTV etc. & when running the “test” with on the onscreen PR the STB still changes channel & all the time i still have the LG remote sensor obscured.

so it’s impossible that IR is involved, here anyway.

one thing that it has affected is my TV sound, each time i do some more testing i hear a loud “ i was watching emmerdale…” 😂😂