Slow broadband - helping neighbour

[BarkingMadBarking]

My neighbour is with BT and has complained about slow BB. N (my neighbour) has a Mk2 faceplate. I've disconnected the telephone and confirmed only connection to the faceplate is from the cable outside. The HH5 reports connected at 23Mb/s down, which is lower than the guaranteed 28-35. Using the BT website we've performed a test and it says an engineer visit is required. However, when it comes to pick an appointment date it shows dates but I cannot click / select any of them. I've tried different browsers and get the same thing. Anyone got any ideas?

Due to the inability to choose a date, we called 150 a few days ago, and the tests had to be repeated by the BT person. The BT person said they could send engineer to check outside or inside. I commented that a check on the inside may result in a no fault found charge, the BT person agreed. We agreed that an outside check should be performed until I could confirm the faceplate was only connected to the outside cable. N has no seen any emails and doesn't have any fault reference number so we don't know whether one was raised and/or if a fault was found.

Given there is no other connection to the faceplate other than the telegraph pole and then to the HH5, I think it is safe to ask for an internal engineer visit because it is all BT equipment. Do others agree?

I'm also wondering whether DLM has kicked in? How can I tell? When I did the test tonight with only the HH5 connected the HH5 went blue and then appeared to reset and start the negotiation again. Perhaps the HH5 is dodgy?

Any help gratefully received.

[iniltous]

The demarcation point for testing purposes is the test port behind the lower panel of a NTE5 type master socket, so that is the point to connect to , to eliminate any possible extension wiring or extension socket issues.
While plugged in the test port, with a (preferably corded)  phone, dial 17070 and take the quiet line test option, and listen for noise, any noise can be reported as a fault , obviously the phone used needs to be fault free.
What the customer service rep has already told you seems a little incomplete, generally they will test the line, if a defect is apparent, then it’s location is estimated by the test equipment, if it’s obviously outside the property, then an Openreach engineer is despatched, if the fault is indicated at the home or no fault at all indicated , then a warning about the potential for charging is given if you ‘insist’ on a visit,   in other words if the fault is not on what OR are responsible for, or there is no fault , then an unnecessary call out charge could be raised.
To get a better idea if the line is underperforming, you need to post the router connection stats, and the estimated speed you should get ,
https://www.dslchecker.bt.com/

The line would only be on a banded profile , if if some issue was causing DLM to intervene in that way, once what ever that issue is resolved generally after a period the banding is automatically removed

[BarkingMadBarking]

Thanks for the reply.

I'm aware of the test socket and the quiet test procedure. I'll do one later. However, there is no internal wiring coming from the master socket.

Do I need to find an old in line (separate filter) and plug it into the test socket and connect the HH5 or is that going too far? 

The service rep didn't mention where the fault had been located. From faults on my line I do remember them being able to pin point to a pavement box about 100m away.

Re connection stats from HH5. I think I can obtain downstream/upstream connection but I'm not aware it shows other stats regarding the "attainable rate" and SNR Margin, Attenuation, Output power etc. Does it?

Added DSL Checker image - the observed speed is way off.

[pippincp]

The troubleshooting/helpdesk page from the HH5 will give us the connection details needed.

[BarkingMadBarking]

Thanks for your help, please see blow

1. Product name: BT Home Hub
2. Serial number: +068343+NQ33812144
3. Firmware version: Software version 4.7.5.1.83.8.264 (Type A) Last updated 01/03/19
4. Board version: BT Hub 5A
5. DSL uptime: 1 days, 00:50:28 - due to accessing test socket etc.
6. Data rate: 5856 / 22372
7. Maximum data rate: 5856 / 41584
8. Noise margin: 6.1 / 14.8
9. Line attenuation: 22.9 / 23.4
10. Signal attenuation: 22.9 / 21.4
11. Data sent/received: 124.2 MB / 744.8 MB
12. Broadband username: bthomehub@btbroadband.com
13. BT Wi-fi: Yes
14. 2.4 GHz Wireless network/SSID: BTHub5-SXSJ
15. 2.4 GHz Wireless connections: Enabled (802.11 b/g/n (up to 144 Mb/s))
16. 2.4 GHz Wireless security: WPA2
17. 2.4 GHz Wireless channel: 1
18. 5 GHz Wireless network/SSID: BTHub5-SXSJ
19. 5 GHz Wireless connections: Enabled (802.11 a/n/ac (up to 1300 Mb/s))
20. 5 GHz Wireless security: WPA2
21. 5 GHz Wireless channel: 48
22. Firewall: Default
23. MAC Address: 18:62:2c:16:f5:d2
24. Modulation: G.993.2 Annex B
25. Software variant: AA
26. Boot loader: 1.0.0

[pippincp]

Unfortunately we do not have the stats from before accessing the test socket so don't know if the line was stable prior to that. If it was then the noise margin suggests a line fault.

[iniltous]

The observed speed on the 6th Nov was 22Mb, which is the data rate shown now, suggesting this issue has been present for a while.
You haven’t said if you performed a quiet  line test , it’s possible that there is a line problem , given that the max data rate is around 41Mb , but the line rate is 22Mb. ( 41 is in line with the estimate)
Testing for noise with a corded phone rather than cordless one is preferable, as cordless phones can filter out noise, giving a false ‘no noise on line’.

Not all line problems are obvious when your provider tests the line, noise problems especially , can be present but a line test gives a ‘right when tested’  result, but an obvious noise fault should be reported as a noisy line, if the line is noisy and reported as such, OR resolving that issue may well get the line performing closer to the max attainable.

[BarkingMadBarking]

Apologies ofr the delay in replying - my neighbour has been busy.

The quiet line test is very quiet - nothing at all - silence.

Looking at the HH5 log I see:

17:53:48, 15 Dec.

( 131.440000) PPPoE is up -​ Down Rate=22372Kbps, Up Rate=5901Kbps; SNR Margin Down=14.3dB, Up=5.9dB

17:28:02, 11 Dec.

( 134.050000) PPPoE is up -​ Down Rate=22372Kbps, Up Rate=5856Kbps; SNR Margin Down=14.6dB, Up=6.1dB

17:27:07, 11 Dec.	( 78.740000) PTM over DSL is up
17:26:28, 11 Dec.	( 39.580000) WAN Auto-​sensing running.
17:20:00, 11 Dec.	(169855.320000) PTM over DSL is down after 2827 minutes uptime
17:20:00, 11 Dec.	(169855.320000) PPPoE is down after 2826 minutes uptime [Waiting for Underlying Connection (WAN Ethernet 2 -​ Down)]

18:12:58, 09 Dec.

( 234.270000) PPPoE is up -​ Down Rate=22372Kbps, Up Rate=5804Kbps; SNR Margin Down=14.6dB, Up=6.2dB

19:51:37, 08 Dec.

( 140.750000) PPPoE is up -​ Down Rate=22372Kbps, Up Rate=6061Kbps; SNR Margin Down=14.6dB, Up=5.9dB

19:24:36, 07 Dec.

( 138.440000) PPPoE is up -​ Down Rate=22372Kbps, Up Rate=6064Kbps; SNR Margin Down=14.6dB, Up=5.9dB

01:19:07, 11 Nov.

(469955.900000) PPPoE is up -​ Down Rate=22372Kbps, Up Rate=5757Kbps; SNR Margin Down=14.7dB, Up=6.1dB

It seems strange that we alwyas see Down Rate=22372Kbps,

My line always connects at 34999 although the attainable is in the 40's but I'm within the guaranteed speed for the product.

Regards

[imjolly]

you switched to test socket on 11/12 and you have now had another reset on the 15/12.  Looks like there was also resets on 7/8/9 December  suggesting an unstable connection which is probably why line is still in banded profile. 

The resets were roughly about same time is it possible neighbour is switching router off?  Or maybe something like heating switching on?

[BarkingMadBarking]

I'd noticed line had only been up for less than 2 days tonight.

The neighbour has had a new boiler.

Perhaps I will try to re-locate router so that it cannot be knocked.