Full Fibre installation with socket in a rear room

[36ULW]

Openreach offer two types of FTTP Install;

Standard, which entitles you up to 10m of Internally run cable. That includes up and over door frames, not as the crow fly’s. Will the Engineer do 15m, 20m, etc of cable? Maybe they will, maybe they won’t. Depends on Engineer, who they work for, what kind of mood they’re in, how big a job it’d be, how quickly they want to get home and if they like you or not.

Premium, entitles you to 50m of internal cable. In all the years I was a CST I only ever once had a premium job and that was at a Business and even then it wasn’t needed as they wanted the ONT in their Comms Cabinet, which was literally 1m from the Internal Duct.

As for the existing copper cable in your house that runs from the BT101a and or BT66. I seriously doubt it’s in any kind of conduit. In fact I’d bet my prize Limited Edition Scale Model Openreach Corgi Van that the cable is just run behind the wall cavity like all the Electrical Cable will be. So if you did want the ONT by the existing NTE and the Engineer is willing to exceed the 10m rule then it’d mean him/her running the cable up and over skirting boards and potentially drilling through internal walls, unless it can go along an outside wall?

[Roy12345]

An internal cable run to the rear living room would be horribly convoluted, I would be in no rush for that option.

I had another look this morning at the areas, plus with a metal detector.  I can confirm the existing copper wire somewhere behind the downstairs loo wall, goes straight up and into the ceiling.  So I think you're right, no ducting and a pull-through rather iffy.

My hope of going straight up the outside wall and in through the front bedroom is obstructed by a canopy roof.  Meaning a long detour around.  I'm not sure they'd try by ladder.

I am wondering (after reading somewhere) about running the fibre which leaves the first junction box around the front of the house at low level, then into the adjoining garage?  They'd have to drill through a lengthways brick, with 100mm of width where they drill between adjacent wall and wooden doorframe.  This would put the router in the garage, maybe better for outside WiFi cameras, but a cavity wall away from the main house re reception.  Easier to arrange extra sockets on a brick garage wall.

What do you think of that option?

[iniltous]

If you want your ONT and router in the garage , provided that power is available, that’s entirely your choice , obviously should you subsequently find coverage in some  places is less than ideal , that would  be your problem to overcome, you couldn’t expect to relocate the ONT after it’s fitted without you having to pay to get that  done , basically you can’t treat it as a trial run .

There  are several options you could use if some rooms have poor WiFi coverage , or even relocate the router leaving the ONT in the garage , personally it’s not a solution I’d go for , obviously any ‘issues’ you would have to go into the garage to check the status of the ONT and router ,but there is no inherent problem with putting the router in a garage if that’s what you want .

[Roy12345]

Thanks, that's useful.  Are you of the opinion the engineer would try to pull (maybe 10m of) fibre internally, using the old copper wire run which goes across a ceiling?  That would be the dream answer, reconnecting the new ONT at the old phone socket.  Otherwise, if considering entry via a first floor bedroom wall, does H&S permit that these days?

[iniltous]

No , it’s almost certain that they won’t even attempt to use the existing internal copper cable that is installed behind finished wall and ceiling surfaces, to try to pull in the optical cable using a hidden cable is a pointless time wasting exercise ,  it simply won’t work , no time will be spent proving this to you when it’s clearly not ‘doable’ .

If you want the ONT near the location of the telephone socket that the router is currently connected to , the cable from the CSP is either surface wired internally or ran externally to a point where the ingress hole can be made near that location , both these options seem to be impractical in your case , so the ONT in a different location to the current telephone socket seems the most likely outcome.

As already stated if you wanted to provide your own Ethernet connection from the ONT location , (probably at the front of the property) , to the current router location at the rear , thats up to you, you can provide this yourself at your leisure after the install is complete or employ someone to do it .

If you wanted the cable from the CSP (ground level) to go up the house wall to a first floor room and site the ONT on the first floor , that’s probably going to be OK , (within the limitations of the Tetra ladder safety system) , but the final arbiter of what can and cannot be done is the installer, anything posted on here is just an opinion , but are to large extent fairly accurate .

FWIW , if the cable is taken into the first floor , it’s unreasonable to expect much ‘internal’ cabling to be done , the ONT fitted pretty much immediately where the cable comes in from outside , you need to appreciate that the tech will have an hour or two for the entire installation, something to have in mind when considering what is likely to be acceptable .

As stated previously, you don’t have to proceed with this change to FTTP , what’s more if it’s likely that you won’t accept what invariably will be offered as far as where the ONT will be fitted , rather than waste Openreach’s and your own time , just cancel the FTTP installation 

[Roy12345]

I would dearly love to cancel the FF install, which carries no benefit to me and could be a headache to the Openreach engineer. But with my current part fibre contract almost expired, the only way to prevent the monthly charge from increasing £5 a month was renewal.

But BT renewal page says my part fibre contract 'cannot be renewed' so I selected the equivalent Full Fibre, same price/speed as old contract. This signup process forces me to set a date for Full Fibre installation; not optional.

If I cancel the FF install, surely I will revert to the lapsed part fibre contract, and be charged £5 a month 'out of contract' surcharge for gaining nothing? Fair?

[iniltous]

I’d said in an earlier post , cancel if the status quo was worth the small additional expense, and it’s actually a removal of a discount that occurs at the end of a minimum term , the price the ‘contract’ reverts to is known at the start , albeit there are also annual increases that change both the discount price and normal price , if you (understandably) would prefer not to pay more than necessary , then the ‘acceptance’ on your part is that there are limits to what will be offered as far as the FTTP installation is concerned.

You have already indicated two possibilities, the ONT/router inside the garage , or in an upstairs room (bedroom presumably) there may well be other options as well  , but it seems on the information you have provided that installation of the ONT near the existing socket , when that socket is at the rear of the property and the duct is at the front of the property , with no clear or obvious ‘path’ between the two is not going to be available.

You may well prefer to simply have the choice to renew and get a new discount but remain as you are , but given the pressure from Government both national and local , industry, the media etc for OR to roll out FTTP  and the billions they have spent , it’s not unreasonable (in my opinion) for those with FTTP available to be incentivised to take it , you do have a choice though , seemingly it’s £5 a month more to stay as you are .

FWIW , it’s sometimes the case , customers post on here their annoyance at having something they don’t necessarily want ‘forced’ upon them , I dare say that afterwards if they were honest the majority would say they were making a mountain out of a molehill