Full Fibre installation with socket in a rear room

[Roy12345]

My renewal of BT Broadband has led to an unavoidable Full Fibre upgrade.  The blurb says the new socket will be 'near your existing socket'.  That socket is in a rear living room, of a 1995 house with concrete ground floor.  They say a small box may be fitted outside.  Am I to assume the BT engineer will pull-through the fibre cabling to replace the copper, which presently goes somewhere under the front garden, then rises about a foot in some conduit, thence goes into the  front wall, and then must run from front wall to rear room & socket?

Elsewhere I read that Full Fibre normally means relocating your router to just inside the front wall, somewhere near your fibre cable entry point; as if they do not want to route the new fibre inside your house.  But my house layout makes siting a router near the front wall very undesirable.

[iniltous]

A house built in 1995 is almost certainly ducted from the footpath , most from this era have the duct   appear against an external wall (signified by the usually grey plastic duct cover and capping) this is where the new optical cable from the footpath will appear ( same as the copper cable ) 

It’s usual to go through the house wall at this point and fit the ONT close to where the cable enters , provided power is available at this point  , but it’s not essential, the ONT can be (within practical and time limits) where you want it …..you are always at liberty to provide your own Ethernet cable or wiring if you want the router located somewhere different from where the ONT  will be located if where you want it cannot be agreed to by the installer but you and the installer will normally discuss and agree where the ONT will go ….if you can’t agree the installation won’t take place.

…..your concrete floor is irrelevant.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3XDl0-KkPy8

[shakey1981]

explabation of install  

take a look here (youtube)

[Roy12345]

Thanks for you reply.  Yes I was fairly sure the run from house to street would be ducted, so quite easy.  You echo what I've read elsewhere, that it's normal to fit the ONT near the entry point.  This exactly is my worry.

In my house that would mean near the toilet cistern in a downstairs front loo, not an option and no power anyway.  There must be conduit behind the wall as the existing socket isn't there either. Next closest option is the hallway beside the front toilet, but there's no power until further down and on the other side of the door way.  Not practical.

Next option would be the kitchen on the front of the house, if the fibre was led a convoluted path around the front doorway.  But the only likely area (under the boiler) has a ring main cable and I wouldn't be happy at the risk (would BT pay for damage?).

Next remote option is leading the fibre up and in via an upstairs bedroom, if engineers climb walls to drill, that is.

Hence I'd really like the ONT where the old socket is.  Being a newish house, I assume a duct was laid in the concrete.  Would he try to pull fibre through it? 

If he couldn't/wouldn't install around these issues/risks, and abandoned the install, where would it leave me?  No internet, or back with part fibre/part copper?  I only want/need a low BB speed, so can live with that as long as it's still available.

[iniltous]

If your house is detached or semi detached then a cable can be ran around the property on the exterior wall and enter at a suitable location ( within limits , as stated , the tech cannot afford to spend too long one any one installation ) , the cable doesn’t have to immediately enter the property as soon as it appears from underground, terraced property doesn’t have the same option as there isn’t a ‘side’ of the property only front and back .

In all cases , detached, semi , terraced housing there can be an ‘ internal’ cable run from the access ‘hole’ to the location of the ONT , but the cable has to be surface wired (so on skirting and around door frames ) and care has to be taken to ensure the cable isn’t ’bent’ through too tight an angle (so no 90 degree bends )  and you can’t expect the tech to devote hours running through multiple rooms to get the ONT a significant distance from the ingress ‘hole’, but reasonable requests are fine .

If you know where the duct comes up against the house wall and your master socket is not really close to that point , the builder probably installed the cable to the master socket themselves at first fix (so it’s behind the finished internal wall surface) and obviously that can’t be done with a retro fitted FTTP cable , my property is a similar age to yours , the master socket is opposite the place where the duct comes up , however there are ‘extension’ sockets in 3 of the bedrooms all the wiring is hidden, installed by the builder , it’s possible the socket you are using wasn’t the master socket originally.

As stated , if for example the ONT was fitted at the front of the property, near a power outlet , but you wanted the router at the rear , you can always run your own Ethernet cable between the two locations.

TBH , you are probably over analysing, if you can’t agree a location, the installer leaves and the order is cancelled , you are not forced into something you don’t want , however , unreasonable or unrealistic requests don’t have to be agreed to .

[Roy12345]

Running a cable above ground internally, whether fibre or ethernet, really isn't going to work here. I don't know where the internal duct from front entry to rear room is, but as it's hidden completely, my guess is the cable from the street is continuous from outside ducting to rear living room.

My question is, will the engineer try pulling through the cable to rear room?

If not, and he aborts the install, how long can I remain on part fibre? I never wanted full fibre anyway, not wanting the higher speed/cost and knowing the install would pose issues. But my renewal of 24 month contract forced me to set a date for it.

[iniltous]

If the duct from the footpath ‘hits’ the house wall at the front and there is a socket in a room at the rear , there won’t be an ‘internal’ duct in the concrete floor for the wiring .

If the duct from the footpath hits the house wall at the front , and a cable can be ran externally on the house wall , front to rear (so down one side if the property) then it clearly can enter at the rear of the property …if you don’t want a cable ran on the external wall , then expecting an internal cable ran through the property front to back , even if you were agreeable, chances are the tech would refuse (too much work and time needed ) 

If you can’t see a practical way to do the job in a way that you could accept, you should cancel the migration to FTTP , as it will waste both your time and the installers

 If the  conversion to FTTP is an add on , and the main driver is the migration to DV , it’s possible to cancel the FTTP part and then simply migrate to DV , staying on FTTC for the time being , as far as for how long , impossible to say , but chances are it will quite a few years before there are any ultimatums along the lines of convert or be cut off ….

[Roy12345]

If the duct from the footpath ‘hits’ the house wall at the front and there is a socket in a room at the rear , there won’t be an ‘internal’ duct in the concrete floor for the wiring 

How are you thinking the copper wire runs internally? Laid through intenal stud walls? I hope not...

There's no route around the side of the house, semi to one side, garage to the other.

I honestly thought I could postpone the Full Fibre for years, not be obliged to set a date in order to renew my contract. There's a £5 monthly fine for going out of contract, so didn't want to delay

Do you think I can cancel the Full Fibre install but still keep the package? Speed is unchanged, so don't need it as stated.

[imjolly]

If you are now in a fibre priority area then renewing/upgrading will necessitate moving to FTTP  if your contract period has ended then you can continue out of contract but you will lose any discounts you received at last renewal.  There is no fine for being out of contract 

[iniltous]

There can be ‘legitimate’ reasons why conversion to FTTP can’t be considered when offered, a renter who’s landlord won’t allow any alteration to the property , or an address where Openreach will levy an excess construction charge to provide FTTP ( that’s not to say your reason for not wanting FTTP is illegitimate ) , and as I understand it , the offer of FTTP at the same time as migration to DV (which presumably is what you have been offered ) has an option to cancel the Openreach visit , migration to DV doesn’t involve Openreach , but changing to FTTP does.

As stated , once FTTP is available, moving provider or taking a new ‘deal’ with the existing ISP normally requires taking FTTP if it’s available , Openreach obviously want customers on the new network once it’s available, but there is no compulsion yet , although it could mean remaining with the current ISP and potentially moving onto an uncompetitive out of contract price once the minimum term expires

….if you are  happier to remain on FTTC paying a little more than necessary , cancel the Openreach visit, in the medium term remaining on FTTC won’t be problematic, however in the longer term it will be , personally I’d bite the bullet sooner rather than later (as it’s inevitable anyway ) but you may think differently.