KCI2 and Complex L2C for Full Fibre Install

[ptrduffy]

I have an engineer visit scheduled for Monday for full fibre install.  I just had a look at the BT Wholesale Checker to see if it was flagging any potential hiccups - see photo.

On the 'FTTP Install Process', does anyone know what KCI2 means?  I'm guessing it's keep Customer Informed?

And what does 'Complex L2C' mean in the 'FTTP Service Info' text?  Is that likely to mean the install is complex?  It's a tenement flat in Glasgow, so I can understand why it might be complex - but we're on the ground floor, so hopefully that makes life easier for the install process (and I've run 20mm conduit with a draw-string from just under the CBT to the internal cupboard where I want the ONT, so maybe even easier than usual).

[pippincp]

You presume wongly.

18.3 KCI overview � Fulfilment
KCIs indicate key milestones during the progression of a WBC order. The following KCIs are supported:
� KCI1 = Acknowledged - an order line is being progressed.
� KCI2 = Committed - a CPD has been calculated
� KCI3 = Completed - an order line has been fulfilled.

You order should progress without problem, stop looking for one.

[iniltous]

L2C is ( IMHO) a somewhat ludicrous abbreviation for ‘lead to cash’ , basically an Openreach ‘operation’  that will lead to ££ revenue ( an  installation of services ) , complex is self explanatory but in relation to an installation of  FTTP and given the survey note shows overhead as the delivery method, then it’s a reasonable assumption that at survey ,  an issue was spotted that would affect a standard single stage overhead install  

KCI2 assure is a two stage installation and follows from a survey return that highlights potential issues , the ISP should use a longer lead time than a single stage installation.

In the extra time a longer lead time provides , a first stage installation visit is made to see what mitigation may be needed , an example with overhead delivery , the property is three stories high  and the existing attachment is higher up than normal and cannot  be reached with standard ladders , so long ladders are needed,  which are not carried by all installers, so the dropwire would be put up by the first stage installation people , leaving the remainder for the second stage installer  to complete, or perhaps access to the existing attachment (  bracket ) is via a flat garage roof and some mitigation needs to be in place ( flat roof training ) , again the ‘risk’ element of the installation is dealt with at the first stage , leaving the ‘easy’ part for the second stage .

The appointment you are given is the second stage visit date  , the first visit ( stage ) is performed before the contract date and in most instances you shouldn’t need to be home , unless it’s quite invasive, in an underground setting, digging a trench through your lawn would be first stage but unlikely to be attempted without the householder present.

Its possible that some installations are flagged as two stage when the problem the survey officer detected wouldn’t necessarily cause a single stage install to fail ( or be delayed ) or it’s a error , but from a customer service point of view it’s better ( but not cheaper for Openreach ) to send the job out this way even if the first stage people consider the job could have been completed without this extra step …but presumably something caused the survey officer to pick the ‘complex’ option.

[36ULW]

This, ‘Complex L2C or Complex Step 1’ is a new thing and is very hit and miss.

When a property is surveyed it is assigned something called an SNN, Serving Network Node, i.e.

Overhead with no Anticipated Issues.

Overhead Hoist Required

Things like that.

Some of these will be classed as, Complex when in reality they’re not in the least bit Complex and could easily be done as a One Stage Installation.

like with some jobs that should be classed as Complex aren’t.

As I said, this ‘Complex’ thing is fairly new and still has a lot of work to be done on it to get it right, which in Openreach terms is basically Never!

[ptrduffy]

Thanks for all the replies.

@iniltousI can see why this might be marked as 'Complex', as it is a 4-storey block - the same annotations apply to all flats in the block.  In my case, I'm on the ground floor and the CBT is on the rear wall of my flat just above ground window height, so I imagine that will move things towards the simple end of the scale.

@36ULWI guess that ties in with your comments that the 'Complex' thing is fairly new - I imagine it can cover a whole spectrum of situations.

It's interesting that, if it's a 2-stage install, I was still given an appointment date with only a one week lead time (I placed the order last Monday, and got an immediate appointment for tomorrow).  Does OR give a date with an assumption that everything will be okay, and then move it out if the first stage shows issues?

@pippincpI'm not looking for problems, just excited for my shiny new FTTP, and naturally curious about the whole process.

[36ULW]

They 2nd Stage Installation Date/Time won’t proceed until confirmation the Stage 1 Job is complete.

If the Stage 1 Job is delayed for whatever reason they’ll just push the Stage 2 Appointment back.

[iniltous]

I don’t know if you are simply ‘pottering’ about on this forum , and have also posted on another more technical forum , but the poster on that other forum situation was that their original provision method was going to be overhead via new poles , but due to objections these new poles were never provided, the alternative solution presumably was wall mounted CBT’s and as the posters dwelling is a  flat/apartment it’s entirely possible that wall mounted CBT’s may have been under consideration as the provision type initially, but issue like new wayleaves  for the FTTP equipment ( the existing wayleave for copper doesn’t cover new work ) and possible access issues ( if the cable from the CBT, which would be at one end of the block of flats , had to travel across other flats on its way to the customer that ordered service )  that method was rejected in favour of poles , but this wall mounted option became the only viable one once the poles were vetoed…in that case it’s possible that the original survey network note was never changed from overhead pole , (the pole at that point in time was proposed not provided ) so a cautious complex L2C and KCI2 was used to wall mounted CBT / cable on wall.
The survey note for wall mounted CBT is different to overhead from a telegraph pole , perhaps in this situation it’s not possible to change retrospectively to a more appropriate survey note , and that depending on the circumstances may no longer need to be 2 stage and ‘complex’ .

Anyway , hopefully your installation goes ahead with no issues .

[ptrduffy]

Good sleuthing, that was indeed me on the other forum - that makes a lot of sense since they did switch from proposed poles to wall-mountwd CBTs.

I'll let everyone know how it goes tomorrow, thanks again.

[ptrduffy]

Install complete.  Subcontractor rather than an OR technician, and he did a very neat job.  Was more than happy to use the conduit and drawstring I had installed, so I have the ONT in the cupboard where I wanted it.  Job took less than 45 mins start to finish.

As an aside, the ONT is tiny - about 8cm x 8cm.

Hub switched to Fibre mode, and fast.com showing 920Mb/s download on a wired PC; getting 250Mb/s on my Macbook on WiFi.  Happy customer here 😁

[iniltous]

Excellent.