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NAROBS
Contributor
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Message 71 of 98

Re: Superfast Fibre 1 Essential

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Is this the new form of "Volunteering", OAPS doing BT's job for them ? After all, we don't want to burden those much put upon City gents with a reduced ROC.

 

N.

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NAROBS
Contributor
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Message 72 of 98

Re: Superfast Fibre 1 Essential

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Here's a thought, doing telecomms maintenance properly could also employ thousands of people and cost a lot more . . . if done properly . . . like the Navy ships  - Only difference is the Tax Payer is the customer buying the "National Security" product and the consequences if you don't pay-up are somewhat more serious i.e.  the residents of those parts of the Rest of the World who comprise the "Forces of darkness"  are in Dover as soon as you like . . . 

Oh dear. I think I've just had a revelation on the road to Damascus (South Harrow ?).

Compressor on  high quality Turkish manufactured Hotpoint fridge started and the computer screen went momentarily blank. That hasn't happened before. Hub doesn't appear to have been affected. And the computer screen runs off of two trailing sockets in series but comes off the same power socket as the hub . B*gger !

N

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g0fvt
Aspiring Contributor
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Message 73 of 98

Re: Superfast Fibre 1 Essential

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Thank you for the replies, as this forum is on a BT domain I would think that problem resolution was the intention. I can't really provide any information on the useful life of buried cables, I do know that some fibre optic runs needed to be replaced very early on because of hydrogen diffusion into the fibre, I also know that some early paper insulated lead sheathed cables were still good after approximately 100 years. In fact such was the price of lead that the scrap value subsidised the replacement program when ultimately it needed upgrading. 

It appears that we both now have working broadband, so perhaps it is time to confine our posts to helping others.

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g0fvt
Aspiring Contributor
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Message 74 of 98

Re: Superfast Fibre 1 Essential

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If the compressor start-up of the fridge is dipping the supply that much it would not be surprising if the router had a brown out. I would imagine that repeating would trigger DLM, and is not something you can attribute to BT.  It might be worth getting the wiring checked. Failing that a small UPS would probably be a good idea. Sadly as in my case although we want to entirely blame BT when our broadband plays up often the issue is influenced by a fault within our own premises. 

 

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NAROBS
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Message 75 of 98

Re: Superfast Fibre 1 Essential

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Being a home mechanicer on cars and having built my own computer kit for the last 20 years, I have learned, sometimes with a vengeance, that faults can have causes that often don't disclose themselves immediately or  have characteristics which the on-board diagnostics system  doesn't identify correctly. That, as far as I'm concerned, is accepted as the start position of fault detection and correction in my  appreciation of the general electro-mechanical World.

Despite the comments I've made on flooded inspection chambers, I  do try to keep an open mind on things - hence my enquiry about the possibility of domestic electric faults effecting Broadband. 

Really, if this is an intermittent thing, I need to get some  sort of data logger on the power supply, cause the likelihood of a domestic equipment fault manifesting when a professional electrician is there is low . . . unless I can provoke the fault to occur. Trouble is, it isn't happening every time the fridge starts up . . . and its only 3 years old . . . but that doesn't necessarily signify nowadays. That's my problem.

There may be a simple way round this. It sounded from the initial responses I was getting on this forum that some part of the BT diagnostic system might have more information on the condition of my line/connection than is available to me. Would they for instance have  a record of dates and times of the consequential effects on data flows on my Hub  so that I could match them to "Brown-out" events  that I provoked. That would help me determine, conclusively whether this piece of domestic equipment was effecting the BT Hub, and in what way.

That said, as far as I can see from the on-line Hub Event page, the possible faulty fridge isn't affecting the HUB.

As far as the flooded inspection chambers are concerned, I wonder what happens to the co-located cable joints in the chillier weather, when say there's a deep frost . . . . you don't have to be a genius to predict that . . . the water will freeze  . . and the cable joints will be subject to the full range of mechanical stress forces, perhaps compelling the cable to move and twist in ways that weren't intended for the installation . . . result . . . reduced life. 

Surely, one of the telephone apprentices could be tasked, at least for the first six-months of his job, to act as the Sancho Panza to the fully qualified technicians Don Quixote and follow him around lifting  the lid and pumping every inspection chamber that the qualified technician previously identified as flooding - the boys at BT technical policy/Martlesham Heath must have a view on this.

I fully appreciate that BT aren't always the cause, whilst at the same time recognising that part of the role of this website is as a "Banana skin" patrol from a technical and reputational point of view.

N

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g0fvt
Aspiring Contributor
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Message 76 of 98

Re: Superfast Fibre 1 Essential

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With fault diagnosis it obviously pays to firstly be very observant of the symptoms and to adopt a methodical approach to narrowing down the cause. Unlike a computer or a car though there is a demarcation line of responsibility and neither party necessarily is privvy to the whole picture. I would not suggest that the fridge is faulty, the inrush current drawn by the compressor will vary in part according to what point in the mains cycle that it is switched on, your computer screen blanking certainly suggests quite a lengthy dip too. It would be relatively easy for you to do a rough impedance check on that ring main, simply by seeing how much voltage drop you get on an adjacent socket when you add a significant load. Depending on the router you use a piece of software that might help you is called RouterStats, it can interrogate the router and provide graphical plots of noise margin, line attenuation etc. It worked well on my HomeHub 5A but does not work on the HH6A.
We clearly have some parallel interests but I don't agonise over the state of the infrastructure that brings the water, electricity and broadband to my home. Likewise if I see it is raining when I leave the house I put my coat on but don't question why it is raining.

FWIW there are some very cheap UPSs on Ebay, maybe a good investment?

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NAROBS
Contributor
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Message 77 of 98

Re: Superfast Fibre 1 Essential

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Looks like others have already agonised for us:-

https://www.ofcom.org.uk/__data/assets/pdf_file/0028/83098/openreach_-_cranfield_university_report.p...

So nothing to see here, move along please  mr plebe consumer. . . . . . except when we get caught up in the consequences of the corporate and governmental neglect of responsibilities . . . . as no doubt some of the residents of Derwent and Don valleys are experiencing over the last few days - that one courtesy of the National Rivers Authority, another quango.

Its clear to me that the  copper side of the FTTC system, is an Austin Allegro trying to perform like a Ferrari Dino and isn't destined long for this World  with the current level of maintenance, witness the fact that some  telephone line men, who should be doing other things, are now dedicated to Broadband signal defects- even the design and construction of the roadside cabinets reflects this - very lighweight compared with their predecessors. If you broke wind heavily whilst passing one you'd put a dink in the shell.

I'd like to think that at least some of the UKs infrastructure was robust enough to meet the requirements of 21st Century civilised living, let alone be able to withstand the rigors of the effects of global warming. But what do we find,  commercialism  and its short-term horizons determines the  standard of the infrastructure  and everything is done just-in-time, skin-of-the-teeth and bodge-to-get-by. 

What's needed, especially with the on-coming climate changes are systems which have defense-in-depth and something that doesn't fall-over in the presence of a scotch mist. The nay-sayers will say, oh your just a silly old plebe consumer whose  not sigtnificant, but trouble is this cheese-pairing attitude on  infrastructure expenditure, in my experience extends into the plans of other institutions i.e. HMG, where speed, reliability and QoS are vital - witness the Government web and overseas comms capabilities of MOD & FO.

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g0fvt
Aspiring Contributor
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Message 78 of 98

Re: Superfast Fibre 1 Essential

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With respect, the document you linked to although raising many issues has a generic "risk assessment" quality to it. I am not sure either that the lighter cabinets are a problem in most areas, certainly there is no need for architectural cast iron cabinets able to resist a kiss from a Morris Oxford. FTTC is a handy interim measure allowing sensible internet speeds to our homes with little disruption, so we can quickly do our Windows updates before accidentally visiting PornHub. I have no desire to put my entire CV on here but I have worked for Ofcom as well as a leading defence contractor etc. With a reasonably unlimited budget it is possible to build extremely reliable and resilient systems, unfortunately this is not the modern way. I don't share your confidence in the various MOD, FO and HMG comms, because I have seen first hand the economies being made. Incidentally many of us who have worked on the engineering of various comms systems are aware of some serious weaknesses that could severely compromise them.
As a matter of transparency perhaps I can mention that my late father worked for BT/Post Office research and was extremely involved in the Goonhilly project, my younger brother worked for BT for 30 years until taking VR.
My Broadband is now fine again, and yours apparently too. I did suggest a few easy to test things within your home that you have not mentioned again. Part of me would like engineering excellence in everything around me, unfortunately a bigger part of me wants to spend my money on other things.....

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NAROBS
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Message 79 of 98

Re: Superfast Fibre 1 Essential

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The speeds have improved and maintained  the improvement since the fix mid-week - they are now at the "Contracted levels".

If you look back at the beginning of this thread, you'll find I did use the router stats app in conjunction with an old HH5 to see what the noise margin was over time. It showed that the  down noise margin decreased significantly from 14db to 6db when the test socket on the FTTC master socket was used. I'm not keen, at the moment , to try and find out what the noise margin over time  is now using the HH5, as I have been using SH2 since the fix and any change of hub may risk upsetting the DLM "Training process" before the 14 day period has completed.

Similarly, I'm not keen to use a UPS until I've found out what's causing the computer screen to blank occasionally. As I'm an AMD graphics user and usually find that that sort of event is related to a graphics conflict, but there's nothing showing in the Windows 10 Event log relating to that. Most frequent error in  the log the last 24 hours relates to a **bleep**-up generating Event 455 in Windows 10 update version 1903 , which appears to be DLL service  fetch ( SVChost) related - seem to be 80 odd instances of that running concurrently.Utilities - BT - Broadband - BTW_Performance_Test - Report_9112019 -9112019_Page_1.jpeg

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g0fvt
Aspiring Contributor
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Message 80 of 98

Re: Superfast Fibre 1 Essential

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Hi, you may as well stay with the router you have, it certainly seems to be working for you. To be honest I had forgotten the beginning of the thread.  FWIW my up and downstream noise margins hover at nearly exactly 6dB and my DL speed is significantly lower than yours. At the moment I cannot remember the package we have, so this might be the ceiling anyway. 

I have a huge number of service hosts listed in task manager, again W10 64bit pro 1903. Event viewer lists over 9000 administrative events, either flagged as warnings or errors. Machine never crashes and apart from Edge grinding to a halt on Facebook tabs from time to time it does not have any issues. It gets used for a lot of radio programming and geekery, not all web stuff. Event log for those events lists about 30 events for yesterday, on average a few an  hour, most I can account for such as jumping from network to network etc.

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