Two phone lines, full fibre and contradictory information

[Deneb]

I had a text from Openreach today confirming the engineer’s appointment, so it hasn’t failed yet. It’s a shame you can’t ask them questions before the day…

[iniltous]

Wasn’t the problem that if you allowed  the SMPF (BT/PN)  FTTC line to be converted to a Plusnet broadband only FTTP service there were unwanted consequences  ? the migration was not really in question it was the seemingly linked cessation of the supposedly separate BT Pre digital phone line that was going to be the problem, it being somehow caught up in the separate SMPF to FTTP migration , are you now relaxed that the BT notification of that cessation is just an administrative error and the likelihood is the PDPL with not be affected and continue to work ?.

TBH , as previously stated that  should be the case as  there is no reason  why there should be any link between these ‘lines’ given they are on completely separate accounts…the previous comments about ‘failure’ was predicated on the assumption you had cancelled the Plusnet  SMPF to FTTP conversion to safeguard the separate BT PDPL telephone only BT line .

[Deneb]

Well, I’d say relaxed is probably overstating it, but as no one seems think that the other line should be affected, I think the only way I can find out for sure is to talk to the Openreach Engineer when they arrive. If they explain to me BT are right (for whatever reason) then I can stop the installation proceeding and go back to Plusnet to complain that what they’d written to me was wrong and see what other solution they can suggest.

[iniltous]

With the greatest respect to the Openreach installer or contractor that turns up to install your FTTP service , they will neither know  or TBH really care what occurs in the background regarding the possibility of the BT PDPL  being ceased as a consequence of this PN FTTP order being completed, if  the ONT they fit can be authenticated onto the headend ( this is independent of any ISP involvement ) then their task is successfully done , what happens subsequently  isn’t really anything they will have any real insight into , what’s more should the PDPL service be affected it’s likely to be the next day or even a few days later , long after they have left site .

Not that it’s worth much , but in my opinion the chances are the PDPL will not be affected .

[chrisjp]

"Each address can only have 1 ONT & 1 FTTP service"

I hadn't realised that. So, if you are in an FTTP area and need telephone service this will of course be via DV.
But if you require 2 telephone lines to your property (which a number of people have had in the past via the old PSTN system), you now cannot have them.
Is that really the case?

[Deneb]

I’ll keep my fingers crossed, but the BT call centre person definitely suggested that the problem that would lead to both landlines being ceased at the same time was a technical installation issue rather than an administrative one - and I’d hope the Openreach engineer will have some insight into that.

[iniltous]

“Each address can only have 1 ONT & 1 FTTP service"
This is only partially true , the network design ( setting the network dimension) is for one ‘connection’ per address , so arguably by giving an address 2 ‘lines’ potentially in the future a different address could be denied service due to insufficient network capacity , but in reality 100% take up isn’t likely so it’s not likely going to be an issue ,chances are there will be unused ports on the CBT , so no point denying someone multiple services if they want to pay for that .

Openreach did have a multiport ONT they could supply , 1 fibre in , upto 4 separate services out , so an address could potentially have 4 separate ISPs if they wanted from a single ONT  , but these have been discontinued. It is possible to order more than one service in an address provided the network isn’t at capacity, that would now need separate ONT’s .

[iniltous]

“I’ll keep my fingers crossed, but the BT call centre person definitely suggested that the problem that would lead to both landlines being ceased at the same time was a technical installation issue rather than an administrative one - and I’d hope the Openreach engineer will have some insight into that” .
That’s probably a case of the call centre representative not really understanding process .

Presumably at the moment you have two dropwires from a pole , or 2 pairs connected in an underground cable , one for your PDPL , and one for the FTTC / SMPF service  (or possibly a single multi pair drop cable with both services in it )
The tech fitting the FTTP , may offer to takedown a dropwire (if your services are from a pole and on separate wires ) so you don’t have 3 overhead cables , 2 copper and 1 fibre , the only way the tech could interfere with the PDPL is if they take down the wrong dropwire from the pole ….but the tech is not going to be interested in the existing services really , it’s an aesthetic thing , if you don’t request the SMPF cable removing , they will probably leave it in situ

….if they do leave the SMPF cable you may find the telephone number you don’t care about and possibly the PN broadband continue to work for a while as well as the new PN FTTP broadband, unless PN are not supplying a new router and you are expected to transfer the router from the copper pair to the FTTP service .

[Deneb]

At the moment there’s a single drop wire from the pole to the house. One pair then goes down the side to the master socket for the non-broadband line whilst the other pair goes along the front and down to the broadband line’s master socket.

I am assuming Openreach will add a second fibre drop wire and leave the existing one in place as that’s what they’ve done for one of the other houses using the same pole. If Openreach intend to replace the existing drop wire with a fibre one then I can see where BT are coming from. 

[iniltous]

Yes a second drop will be put up , if the tech doesn’t ask , clearly you need to say the existing dropwire needs to remain to keep the PDPL in service but  I doubt that’s what the BT representative was concerned with when they called you about the standalone BT phone number now  a PDPL , not every overhead installation of FTTP has the old copper wire removed anyway , BT don’t  get involved with that Openreach function

The new optical cable will almost certainly follow the same route from pole to house wall but from there it doesn’t need to follow the same path as the copper cable if you wanted the ONT in  a different location to the master socket ….in some cases the location has to change if it’s not practical or too time consuming to put the ONT near the master socket, you discuss this on the installation day …..the point about BT contacting you about the unrelated line when PN raised their order wasn’t to discuss this , they clearly were notified that the Plusnet order was having an impact on the BT service, the odd thing is they quoted the PDPL number and not the number associated with the FTTC service ….and as BT had already converted your standalone BT phone service away from PSTN , they had no reason to contact you again about that …it’s weird