digital voice and draytek vigor 2862

[Hmmmm]

Hi Again WSH,

I trust all is well with you?

Ok as I stated in a previous post the BT contractors are currently laying Fibre throughout the village.

Therefore sometime in the future I will get a automatic upgrade to BT FTTP.

Considering my current Draytek 2860 is grossly out of date I am looking to upgrade to something like the Draytek 2927ax, this model does not have a DSL modem but after some research into BT FTTP I do not think I need a modem.

Looking at BT hub options for FTTP it looks as though I will get a BT smart hub, a BT home hub 4 or 5. In which case looking at the install instructions the BT FTTP modem mounts on the wall and the hub plugs into "Port 1" of the FTTP wall modem and then into WAN port of hub with red ended Ethernet cat 5/6 cable. The DECT then plugs into the TEL socket on the wall mounted FTTP modem from what I can see.

Given the current setup i.e. BT SH2 behind Vigor 2860 connected via EWAN, am I correct to assume that a future BT FTTP wall mounted modem negates the need to a setup similar to what I currently have? And that I can potentially connect the new Vigor 2927ax directly into the BT FTTP wall mounted modem and the DECT phone into tel port?

Thanks Hmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[licquorice]

No, wrong on many counts.

If you wish to continue using Digital Voice, you will still need to use the Smart Hub2. Port 4 on the SH2 can be toggled between being a LAN port or a WAN port. For FTTP, you configure port 4 as a WAN (FTTP mode) and connect it to the ONT (optical modem) instead of connecting the DSL port to your master socket.

[WSH]

Firstly, I wouldn’t get too excited.  There is a lot more going on behind the scenes than just laying the cables.  It may be another 12-18 months before it is ready for service, (or RFS).

I’m not familiar with the 29 series, so I’ll take your word for it, that it is a router only.  You are right, however, FTTP does not need a DSL modem.  The 29 series are industrial capacity and may be a bit over-the-top for a domestic install, (but then so was the 2860).  You may be able to find a cheaper model than that, but up to you.

Anyway, to the more important points:

The FTTP “modem” is a box mounted on the wall, called an ONT or Optical Network Terminal.  The phone socket on it was an early experiment and is now defunct.  (I don’t think the latest models have a socket).  In other words, you will still need the Smart Huib 2, if you want a phone.   (The Home Hub 4 and 5 are obsolete – I don’t know where you got those from).  The “red ended” cable is the same as the yellow ones.  In fact, any standard cat 5e/6 cable will do.  And yes, it connects from the RJ45 port on the ONT to port 4 on the Smart Hub 2.  (Port 4 can be configured for “FTTP mode”, i.e. as a WAN port).  The rest of the setup remains the same.

Also, while I’m here, you may not be aware that Draytek released an urgent security update for most of its range yesterday, including the 2860.  Available here:

https://www.draytek.co.uk/support/downloads

[licquorice]

@Hmmmm not wishing to be rude, but as a self confessed beginner, I'm wondering why you need a fancy router at all rather than simply using the SH2 on it's own.

[Hmmmm]

Good day Liquorice,

I trust all is well with you?

Thanks once more for your comprehensive replies it is very much appreciated.

Whilst this forum as graded me as a beginner I must confess that I have been building bespoke water cooled, very fast desk top PC's, and been building and configuring networks for a number of decades. I come to this forum to gain the knowledge and experience of the likes of your good self and WSH.  Because my knowledge and experience of everything before the router from BT is limited 

In answer to your question I need the Draytek 2927 because I have the whole property on a pretty sophisticated network, a Draytek WiFi mesh network for all devices reliant on WiFi, the upgrade to the 2927 will take me to WiFi 6 in conjunction with Draytek AP906 WiFi 6 Access point. This will permit high volume data streaming for Sky on all devices on WiFi and the transfer of very large photoshop files from desktop PC to laptop etc. 

The current and future Draytek routers are also ethernet cabled to a 25 port Draytek G1241 switcher, of which 18 ports are connected to different devices. I have a number of VLAN's off this switcher to prioritise, isolate and control data transfer for things like the property CCTV system.

My wife and I are professional and qualified photographers I build our water cooled PC's and configure our network to run the devices that enable us to work on very large files, average size file with 12 layers from within Photoshop is approx 75 GB. The PC's have very fast DDR5 64GB memory with XMP profiles running, Intel 14th gen i9 top of the range processors, both memory and processors are over clocked to get maximum performance from them. I only use Gigabyte Intel Aorus Xtreme MoBo's they are the best for overclocking and water-cooling of the processor, memory and graphics card, in my experience they are also the most reliable and stable after overclocking. Photoshop is a memory hungry programme, it can freeze a poorly built PC or lock it out, let alone take down or freeze a network if a 75GB file is being transferred through the wrong path.

So as I am sure you will agree and can now see the SH2 is totally incapable of doing the above without a little bit of help from Draytek technology. 

I could go on and on but I am in danger or boring you to death with all of my turgid PC stuff, I trust I have answered your question and quenched your intrigue?

Thanks Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[licquorice]

Thank you for your comprehensive explanation.

May I suggest an alternative to using the BT SH2 would be to port your phone number to a third party VoIP provider and thus obviate the need for it at all to simply provide a voice capability.

Unfortunately, BT don't make the process simple as although it is possible to order broadband service without telephony, ceasing an existing telephony service results in the broadband service also being ceased.

[Hmmmm]

Hi WSH,

Trust you are well?

Thanks again for your prompt and comprehensive reply.

Firstly, I wouldn’t get too excited.  There is a lot more going on behind the scenes than just laying the cables.  It may be another 12-18 months before it is ready for service, (or RFS).  As usual my thoughts were along the same lines as yours but some neighbours at the North end of the village have already started to get FTTP installed, but I will confess the contractors have been in the village since this time last year. 

I’m not familiar with the 29 series, so I’ll take your word for it, that it is a router only.  You are right, however, FTTP does not need a DSL modem.  The 29 series are industrial capacity and may be a bit over-the-top for a domestic install, (but then so was the 2860).  You may be able to find a cheaper model than that, but up to you.  Yes both your good self and Liquorice have been advising me that my choice of routers is OTT, however, see my confession/response to Liquorice on this subject, it might explain my choice hopefully.  

The FTTP “modem” is a box mounted on the wall, called an ONT or Optical Network Terminal.  The phone socket on it was an early experiment and is now defunct.  (I don’t think the latest models have a socket).  In other words, you will still need the Smart Huib 2, if you want a phone.   Just my luck, living in hope that  I could bin the SH2 and connect the new Draytek directly to BT FTTP Modem will remain a dream. (The Home Hub 4 and 5 are obsolete – I don’t know where you got those from). I saw  these online listed as BT's FTTP wall mounted modem, I have no idea what I will get, hence the reason why I seek your experience and knowledge.    The “red ended” cable is the same as the yellow ones.  In fact, any standard cat 5e/6 cable will do.  And yes, it connects from the RJ45 port on the ONT to port 4 on the Smart Hub 2.  (Port 4 can be configured for “FTTP mode”, i.e. as a WAN port).  The rest of the setup remains the same. Ok thanks again for that, BT SH2 remains very much in situ change/switch it to FTTP mode, and connect to WAN port 4 on SH2, Draytek router remains as per your previous advice.

Thanks too for security update heads-up to Draytek kit 

Take care Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[Hmmmm]

Hi Liquorice,

Pleased my explanation clarifies the situation.

Thanks too for your suggestion of considering VoIP, and rapid reply.

I have briefly looked into this with the current Draytek router having two VoIP ports, but not too deep.

Am I correct to assume that a VoIP phone can only make and receive calls from and to another VoIP phone? 

As you state BT do not make life easy, I have been with them for decades and apart from the gripes I make on this forum  I have found the service good. I have never used and BT IT equipment apart from the current forced set up with the SH2 for DV, and I am sure the low spec, low grade components inside the SH2 are taking their toll on data transfer speed and volume. 

Loath to make changes to the current contract for fear of losing everything, our business is too reliant on the land line and internet.   

Thanks Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[licquorice]

Digital Voice is just BT's implementation of VoIP. As with DV, third party VoIP calls can be made to and from any number not just other VoIP users.

[WSH]

Sorry for the delay.  Been up to Asda to feed my eating addiction.

As Liquorice says, under the circumstances do away with the SH2, connect the Draytek directly to the ONT and go with a third-party VoIP provider.  A lot of businesses are now switching to VoIP so clearly it must talk to the whole range of numbers they deal with.  The last place I worked was in the process of doing it as I was retiring, so unfortunately, I didn’t have much direct involvement with it.

As an aside, a lot of the routers of the 2860 generation were built for DSL and so only have a max throughput on the firewall of something like 350-450Mb/s.  The 2762 can go to 950Mb/s with hardware acceleration turned on but I don’t know about the 2860.  I suspect, if you do upgrade to FTTP and want those sort of speeds then the 2860 will definitely need to go.