Full fibre installation has also destroyed my elderly mum's landline

[mb10]

Bit of a long one, so apologies in advance ...

My 86 year old Mum lives on her own, and the rest of the family is at the other end of the country.

She's always had a landline, but some years ago decided she was transferring from BT to Utility Warehouse as her provider.

We put in a second line, separate account, billed separately, which BT provided broadband to for us to use when we visit.

Yesterday, as part of the full fibre upgrades, an Openreach subcontractor came to install a fibre line to replace the broadband.

But, what he's also done, is to completely remove all the copper, including the line on this separate number and account, leaving her without a phone.

We reported this as a fault via Utility Warehouse and an Openreach engineer has attended today to say that he can't reinstate the line and that our best bet is to get some VoIP handsets, and migrate her number over to the full fibre set up.

Apart from being furious that she's without a landline, my questions are this, please:

Is there no way of just getting this line reinstated ? I understand that a migration will need to happen in the near future, but it should be when and how we choose - Mum's had no comms from Utility Warehouse about a time-frame as far as they're concerned.

If I do need to port a number over, do I have to try and do this via Utility Warehouse or BT ? What's the process - both providers website are very unclear on this.

Finally (for now), what's the 'real world' process for escalating this to some kind of action ? So far I've spoken to people who are very apologetic but can't do anything to help Mum get her phone line back.

Thanks very much.
   

[licquorice]

Certainly the best way forward is to port the number to BT Digital Voice, you don't need VoIP handsets to do that, simply plug her existing phone into the BT hub rather than the phone socket.

However, I'm afraid I don't know how you achieve that. 

In the first instance, as far as Utility Warehouse are concerned, there is a fault on the line which they need to rectify. The fact it was an Openreach technician that caused the fault by disconnecting the cable is in a way irrelevant.

[mb10]

Thank you! that's helpful.

I'm unclear on what happens as a result of the Openreach engineer's visit today, where he's effectively just offered some workarounds but not addressed the problem/fault - does this go back to Utility Warehouse as unresolved or does something else happen ??

Would appreciate any insight from anyone on this.

[iniltous]

This doesn’t make much sense, if the UW ‘line’ was totally separate telephony only line ,  and in the course of converting a separate ‘line’ that had a standalone BT broadband service on it to FTTP , the tech incorrectly also took down the copper cable for the UW ‘line’ as well as the copper line for the BT broadband service ( 2 lines possibly in the same cable ) , then the Utility Warehouse ‘dialtone’ should still be present at the block at the top of the telegraph pole and only needs a new copper drop-wire erected to the house to restore the UW telephone service , provided the tech on the UW fault ( who turned up after the original tech that did the FTTP migration on the other BT line ) was told UW service is disconnected, they simply put up a new copper dropwire , and the service is restored, the tech on the fault would have no knowledge of the FTTP migration unless the customer told them , this is basic copper wire repair stuff, a missing wire is no different to a faulty wire that needs replacing ….however I doubt that’s the full story ,

I suspect something more fundamental has happened to the UW service, not just a missing copper dropwire , perhaps UW haven’t advised your relative that they can’t continue as they were and PSTN telephony only has to end , and they (UW) basically arranged for the  service to be ceased ( hence why it can’t be restored, it no longer exists) BTW , BT can’t cease a UW service, but OR , if the communication provider (UW) did nothing after repeated warnings that their service needs  to be moved off PSTN telephony, may elect to force UW hand and cease it .

You have posted here on a BT forum, and although understandable to an extent , this issue has absolutely nothing to do with BT , your BT broadband service was migrated to FTTP successfully , if Openreach have removed UW services, that’s not BT , if UW have arbitrarily ceased a PSTN  service, that’s not BT , if Openreach have decided not to repair an ‘active’ UW PSTN line , that’s not BT .

You need to be contacting UW , you need to know the actual status of the line ( is it ceased , pending a cease , or still active ) , if still active, it’s UW responsibility to get OR to restore the PSTN service even if it’s at best only a few weeks or months until a permanent change is needed , if UW have ceased it , or OR have unilaterally ceased it because of UW intransigence, it’s still UW problem to solve.

The tech was only giving what they suspect the solution is ( and it has some validity as a longer term solution ) but shouldn’t be taken as ‘gospel’ 

[mb10]

Thanks for this.

To clarify, UW haven't done anything other than raise a fault when I reported it. If I dial Mum's number it still creates a ring tone (not in the house, obviously). At the moment my impression is that the Openreach engineer who attended today wasn't allowed/empowered to simply reinstate the copper - but I don't think that's because of any instruction from UW.

Because it feels at present that the various parties are using each other to not do anything, I'm trying to figure out what/who I need to get hold of to get this resolved, so thanks very much for increasing my understanding of who should do what.

[licquorice]

It is firmly in the court of UW to resolve this. 

It is absolutely no different to there being a faulty cable. As said previously, the fact it was removed by an Openreach tech is immaterial.

You need to be insistent with UW that they resolve it.

However, in the very near future the analogue line will be ceased anyway. I have no knowledge of what UW's plans are for telephony only customers at that point.

[WSH]

BT and Openreach are actually separate companies, (although both come under the umbrella of “BT Group”).  As Has been, the disconnection is is nothing to do with BT, or this forum, but my own experience may be interesting.

Twelve months ago, I had full fibre installed.  The installer was from MJ Quinn, an Openreach subcontractor.  He wanted to disconnect the copper line and I told him to leave it intact for the time being, which he kindly did.  It makes me wonder, though, if your installer disconnected the copper line as a matter of routine, not realising it was still in use.

Not to cut across iniltous, who is actually the expert in this area, the thought occurs that if her exchange is already subject to a copper “stop sell” order the Openreach tech may not be allowed to reconnect it.

As has also been said, the easiest thing may be to upgrade the BT broadband to broadband + Digital Voice.  In which case, the existing phone just plugs into the back of the BT Smart Hub and the number can be ported across by BT.

[licquorice]

Even if it's a stop sell area, the service hasn't been ceased it has gone faulty and a solution is required from UW.

How to achieve moving to BT DV is the tricky bit, not straightforward.

[WSH]

@licquorice   Fair enough.  Just thought it might help.

[licquorice]

Agreed it might be why the tech didn't replace the cable, but I suspect it was probably more a lack of inclination, he could have just said the cable was damaged and needed replacing rather than saying it had been recovered.