Elderly/vulnerable customers without Broadband - Notification of new Digital Voice service

[iniltous]

You may consider it anti competitive, but how is it ?, what competitor companies are demanding the retention of some sort SMPF system on an all IP network ?, if your parents pay EE for broadband and BT for line rental they are almost certainly paying more than if they used either EE or BT for both , and the major LLU providers, like Sky and Talk Talk ( that represent around 50% of the users on Openreach network ) many years ago gave their SMPF customers a choice , migrate to full LLU from SMPF  ( so Sky or Talk Talk would provide both services ) or leave and find another provider that would provide a separate broadband on a ‘BT ‘ line .

Anti competitive ?, not even the regulator can make a provider stay in the SMPF market they don’t want to be in , unless that provider is BT, hence the few ( dispute that all you like ) consumers still on SMPF, FYI the only volume SMPF provider was BT anyway , BT line rental and someone else being the ISP , the Post Office  for a short while provided line rental with the option for the PO customer to have someone else providing broadband, but it didn’t last long, all other major providers dumped SMPF as soon as the option to provide their own branded telephony was available , only BT we’re obliged to keep this arrangement.

The transition to an all IP network doesn’t lend itself to ‘line share’ , and it’s ridiculous to pretend that from a technology point of view that an all IP network is a retrograde step , it’s the exact opposite, and in your parents case , the pretty obvious step is to become an EE customer for both , the dialtone will sound the same , the calls will ( for now ) connect the same way , the billing will be simpler ( one bill date , one bill ) and almost certainly will save your parents some money , it will be seamless, the work done remotely, so no visit to the house , and when EE change to IP for their telephony there are no line share complications, and the finally irony, EE and BT are part of the same group anyway ,  EE is going to become the consumer brand for BT Group , BT becoming the business brand , so even if there were not the move to all IP , your parents would be presumably be on EE for both services anyway when BT rebrand as EE for domestic users.

As far as tiny numbers on SMPF , Ofcom have a wealth of information if you are really interested you could look it up  , I don’t need to supply a link , you can disagree and claim that there are huge numbers still on SMPF using your sample size of 1 , it makes no difference, it’s happening with the regulator acquiescence anyway.

[garybs29]

@Tim123 I've heard it all now. How is people having 1 provider which will be cheaper overall (having separate providers means they'll be paying full price line rental) anti-competitive?

[Tim123]

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I've heard it all now. How is people having 1 provider which will be cheaper overall (having separate providers means they'll be paying full price line rental) anti-competitive?

Anti-choice then.

My parents are on BT's ‘Home Phone Saver’ plan, which is specifically for customers who only take a phone service with BT - i.e. not broadband as well, although (unlike with 'Line Only Discount') they can have that with another provider. It’s a splendid package, full of normally expensive calling features (most of which will cease to exist on Digital Voice) and is also inflation-proof. If they move their broadband to BT prior to Digital Voice migration, will they be allowed to stay on Home Phone Saver? My bet is not. That plan and also 'Line Rental Plus' (which is far from inflation-proof) will probably be discontinued and those customers will be forced to move to one of the expensive “minutes” bundles, the price of which increases each year. They will also, no doubt, lose their free paper bills and means of paying by any payment method.

As for Line Rental Plus, that was brought in by BT as a clever way of disguising the much-criticised non-Direct Debit payment surcharge of £2 a month, by throwing in lots of inclusive calling features (mostly the same ones as Home Phone Saver), which again are normally very expensive. But as most of those features are being axed with Digital Voice (and the remaining ones will be free, except for Call Barring), its unique selling point will be lost.

[iniltous]

It pretty certain that your parents have not been contacted by BT yet about DV , at the moment it’s existing BT broadband customers being migrated , when this issue comes up it’s invariably someone complaining on behalf of someone else , incorrectly assuming that if they ( as a BT broadband customer ) are moving to DV , then ‘what about’ the poor telephony only customers and shared metallic path customers must also be receiving notification about DV , when the reality is both groups although eventually will be affected, it’s not imminent, December 2025 is still 17 months away .

No one knows yet what exactly will be offered to BT phone only customers, but it will be part of the IP network , the new terms on IP probably will be exactly the same as they are now on PSTN , the only difference is plugging the phone into a ‘box’ connected to the ‘line’ , so if they are on Home phone saver plan  , provided it’s still available no doubt they will continue on those terms , although it’s currently technically possible to use home phone saver plan with SMPF broadband from other providers, given home phone saver only specifically precludes BT broadband , it’s probably against the spirit of the deal , which is aimed at phone only customers .

As far as call plans that are currently only available to SMPF customers , companies change their consumer offers all the time,  no one could join EE broadband today on this basis , it’s the preserve of legacy customers  , if your parents elect to stay with BT for home phone saver telephony when moving to DV and that means that they cannot have broadband from EE ( ignoring the rebrand of BT to EE ) or anyone else ,  because they will already be on BT broadband albeit a 0.5Mb service, that physical fact stops them from taking anyone else’s broadband then that’s unfortunate, but any change that is to their  material detriment ,  they can leave penalty free , and have the choice of whatever is available in the marketplace , if that isn’t as good as they have now , that’s just too bad, no deal is guaranteed for ever , they will have the choice to stay with either BT , or more likely EE for both services, or leave and use someone else, or use BT ( or EE ) on DV with home phone saver and not use a network other than the Openreach network for their broadband needs.

[ama99]

Re: [iniltous] to [Tim123] "It pretty certain that your parents have not been contacted by BT yet about DV , at the moment it’s existing BT broadband customers being migrated"

Iniltous, may I ask if you are perhaps a BT employee, so have some inside knowledge on these matters?

As previously mentioned (2/7/23), my elderly parents were emailed by BT about DV and they are not BT Broadband customers, only BT telephony. Whilst the email did not state specific dates, it gave the impression the migration was sooner rather than later. I have yet to find anyone in Customer Services who can assure me that my parents can be delayed in the migration (preferably winter 2025).

As to [Tim123] parents, whilst it may seem an unusual choice these days to have SMPF customers, years ago there were valid reasons to split between suppliers other than just cost-based, e.g. reputation, reliability of service, etc. In my parents case, they were happy with BT telephony (been with BT for 50+ years with the same phone number), but preferred a different BB supplier (O2/Sky BB since 2010).

[Tel61]

My mother-in-law is 95 and only has a landline. She hasn't got a computer or broadband and wouldn't want it.  She certainly isn't the only one in this county either.  What happens when the big digital switchover happens next year?

This topic seems to have been covered quite extensively on this forum, but I haven't as yet seen a straight answer to what I thought was simple question.

So straightforward answers please.

[licquorice]

The straightforward answer is that landline only customers will be supplied with a new phone that will operate via VoIP and a low bandwidth line.

They will simply unplug their analogue phone and plug in the replacement device.

[Tel61]

Hooray! Thank you.

I presume they will send her a letter about this in good time before the switchover?

[HHGTTG]

Plug into their existing socket? But I thought after the switchover these would be redundant/dead/defunct? 

[iniltous]

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You are in danger of conflating the FTTP rollout with the PSTN switch off ,

DV is required for BT telephony after the PSTN switch off , it doesn’t need FTTP , so in the simplest terms , someone without any broadband (ADSL/VDSL ) , that currently has a regular telephone plugged into a ‘phone socket’  , they will be supplied with a ‘box’ that plugs into that socket and their existing phone plugs into the supplied box ( the box will need to be also plugged into the mains ) the fact that the box is effectively broadband modem just for telephony is immaterial to the customer , in the background the customer will be converted to a low  bandwidth (0.5Mb ) broadband service , in these cases the copper pair into the home is still used.