Convert BT line to ethernet for fttp install?

[Mikert]

I have an upcoming fttp install booked for next week, and an trying to plan ahead. 

Currently BT line comes into loft from pole outside house, into master socket (in loft) linked to downstairs slave, where router is now.

Would it be feasible to convert these BT faceplates to ethernet sockets, so the ONT can be in the loft and keep the router downstairs in it's current position utilising these ethernet sockets?

I'm anticipating installer not happy going into loft, but he won't need to if he pushes enough cable in to reach the hatch.

I really don't want cabling coming down the front of my house if it can be avoided.

Thanks in advance 🙂

[iniltous]

I can’t follow your train of thought , if you (correctly) assume the installer won’t enter the loft , then how does the potential conversion of the master socket in the loft and extension socket downstairs ( and the connecting extension cable ) into a makeshift Ethernet ‘patch’ help , assuming that can be done which isn’t that likely if the cable is standard telephone extension cable , the ONT will still be outside of the loft , somewhere accessible from outside of the property and near a power outlet, you then need to provide your own way of connecting the ONT to the master socket in the loft (that’s hopefully now an Ethernet socket ) , how do you get a ‘long’ Ethernet cable from the ONT to the loft ?, this isn’t the installers problem, and they won’t leave the ONT unmounted on a long lead so you can move it around at your leisure…it will be fixed in place as will the cable from the external CSP block .
If your router is downstairs anyway , it seems weird to no simply place the ONT downstairs, which means the cable from the pole running down the exterior of the property , you say the if the tech can pushes enough cable in to reach the hatch , what cable do you think this is ?

[Mikert]

Thank you @iniltous for swift reply. 

You obviously are more knowledgeable than I on these matters, but here are my assumptions which I'd be grateful if they could be confirmed.

I assumed the fibre cable would/could come into my loft using a similar route as current copper BT line. 

2 metres away from wall is the hatch which this fibre cable could come to, to be terminated to the ONT.

ONT could plug into the newly converted (8 wire cat5e in use already for master to slave) ethernet socket (10cm from hatch, along with electric socket)

Router could stay in current position, but plug into the other end, newly converted ethernet socket.

Thank you 👍

[Mikert]

So I just re-read your reply. 

Are you saying the ONT will be outside the house and NOT in the loft as I'd hoped?

And just to add, I'd be converting the sockets to ethernet before installer arrives.

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[imjolly · Accepted solution]

normally the fibre cable from the pole to your home at roof level will then run down the wall to ground level to the CSP and then through wall into your home and connected to the ONT.  If your loft is not floored and accessible then unlikely installer will fit anything in your loft

[iniltous]

The ONT is a mains powered internal box that the router connects to with an Ethernet cable , the one supplied is around 1.5m in length , hence normally a double power outlet is needed as the router will be very close to the ONT .

If I make a few assumptions about how I think you think you could have your service installed and how it actually needs to be installed , the cable from the pole comes via the CSP , an external wall block where the cable from the pole is spliced to an internal grade optical cable that has a pre-fitted optical plug that goes into the ONT (so the ONT  has an optical cable coming in , and an Ethernet cable going out to the router as well as a power cord . )

 If the loft is out if bounds for the installer but you want the ONT upstairs minimum , and for arguments sake , the landing at the top of the stairs underneath the loft hatch is suitable  , so the ONT is fitted there , you then need your own longer Ethernet cable , and be able to get it into the loft yourself , then you need to  connect it to the master socket that you have converted to an Ethernet socket , and downstairs you connect the router to the extension socket that was also converted to an Ethernet socket ….the installer can’t push the optical cable plug into a hole that goes into directly into the loft and let you fit the ONT yourself  , that’s why I think your ‘plan’ isn’t really possible , the ONT won’t be in the loft but outside it , how close to the loft can be known until the installer turns up , if that’s on the first floor that’s normally doable , so potentially less  external cable visible  but you have the problem of getting your own cable into the loft to use your converted sockets .

If you convert the master socket and extension socket to Ethernet in advance your existing broadband won’t work unless you move the router to the loft and separate the incoming cable from the Ethernet extension.

[Mikert]

Thank you all for your input.

So I understand now it seems very unlikely.

But, ever hopeful, I will convert the BT sockets to ethernet. It will cost less than £10, and take less than an hour on the morning before installer turns up in afternoon. So I'm quite happy to ask, but prepared for not being able to. Not a lot to lose.

I have read the router can be up to 100m away from the ONT so I'm well within that. 

Everything will be ready, It's just hoping he will be happy with the ONT in the loft. BUT, I do understand how unlikely that is now. Although in my naivety I'll keep my fingers crossed and hope for the best.

Thank you.

[pddco]

Just a thought. Looking at the point where the span from the pole to your house ends. Can you perhaps picture a different place where the span ends on the house? Could that make the external drop to a ground level CSP less obtrusive?  You  could  then at least ask the OR person if it were feasible to do that as an option. 

[WSH]

I do love your optimism, my friend.

I assume, from what you’ve said, that the cable in place is already 8 wire, cat 5e UTP.  Seems a bit over the top for a phone extension, but...

I’ve done this sort of thing for a living and even I wouldn’t count on that taking “less than an hour” and on getting it done immediately before the installer turns up.  A few points:

• You will need an IDC punch tool to connect the sockets.  Have you got one?
• You may well find the back boxes are not deep enough for RJ45 sockets.  I’d check beforehand if I were you.
• Yes, it will go a 100m…under ideal laboratory test conditions, top quality cable and a perfect install.  Working practice is more like 80 to 85m
• If you ever intend to be one of these people that wants silly speeds like 1.6 Gb or 2.5 Gb etc.  you may find cat 5e isn’t up to it.  Cat 6 would be better.  Unofficially, cat 6 will handle 10 Gb/s at up to 55m.

Good luck.

[Mikert]

Thank you again.

Yes 8 stand already there. The house was built with a few Ethernet routes in place, from router (in study) to Lounge (for TV & sky), and from utility (where rainwater comes in) to water tanks in loft. So I guess sparkly used the same roll for everything. The cable says Cat5e.

You're right about the loft backbox depth, loft one too narrow, but downstairs one in wall is ok. 

A push tool arrived this morning along with the 2 x ethernet faceplates.

👍🙂