Going around in circles

[nolimitzz]

• @Hinew to BT and will.try and kdfl this short. Back in December tried to sign up to the socisl tarif bt essential with 700 landline minutes for £15. Was asked if I wanted digital voice to which I said NO as I want to use my landline and not ready for the move yet. 2 managers told me that's fine I will not be forced onto digital voice. However when the contract was emailed to it it mentioned my move to digital voice which u had refused. So I rang up BT they told me it was a mistake and to cancel. This went on 3/4 times cancelling and reordering. My contract with talktalk ended and BT still hadn't sorted out my package. In the end a manager advised they will move me onto BT essential £36.50 until I go live on that day they will shift Me to the home essentials with home phone and broadband via copper@@ £15. My activation was today I got a email saying I've placed the order everything was good then again I get an email with a 2nd contract saying digital voice ( annoying)

I've spoken to 2 managers, 5 staff members all tell me I'm under no obligation to take up digital voice yet until 2025 when everyone will be moved yet I'm lumbered with the same digital voice which I don't want. My question is why can't BT sort this out I've only been with you 1 day but thinking of leaving as I've wasted 2/3 hours on the phone aswell as 10+ hours online trying to sort this. It is mentally exhausting. FFTTP isn't available to me. With talk talk I was getting anytime calls and fibre through my copper line . All I'm asking for is the same stop forcing digital voice on me just yet I have a vulnerable person living with me I'm not ready for this just yet.

Why put me on a £36.50 plan which is the same as the £15 social tariff plan minus the digital voice? All you need to do is keep me on my same plan but continue to use my landline for the calls and not rely on digital voice. BT says that it is available stil to use and get my fibre through copper

Currently I'm lumbered with charges and an unwanted plan

Colleague of mine signed up to the same package there's is fine yet 5 weeks later I'm still at stage 1.

For my previous complaint I was offered a £20 credit in my account even that is missing

[RIC9380]

I really don't understand why some people say that they don't want/won't have BT's Digital Voice Service full stop.  It's just like the national programme of the 1960s when all households converted from from town gas to natural gas or the switch off of analogue TV which was completed by the end of 2012.   It was only 20-30 years ago that BT switched off the last of the electromechanical 'Strowger' exchanges. 

So, for the avoidance of any doubt,  Openreach will switch off its analogue phone service ("POTS") by the end of 2025 full stop.  Like the gas and TV examples above you do not have any option to opt out of the change.  It will happen.

There is no extra charge for BT Digital Voice which also includes many inclusive calling features.

You say that you still want to use your landline.  You will still be able to do so.  I really don't know what your problem is.  You say that you find the switch to Digital Voice annoying.  Why?  What do you find annoying about retaining the ability to still make and receive telephone calls?

RIC9380

[nolimitzz]

Hi everyone has their own preference. I can't get FFTTP at the moment so I don't find digital voice convenient. Secondly in case the broadband goes down or a fault I understand the phone will stop working . I live with an elderly person who has eye sight issues and does not know how to use a mobile. In case of an emergency how would they ring me if there was a problem at home. I'm not saying I'm totally againstbit just not ready for it until absolutely necessary.BT told me that was findyas there is a pause on it so I would just like what I'm paying for. Lastly no I will lose my landline I'm on a shopping survey panel where I transmit my tracker information via my phone line already they told me it's not compatible without a working landline.

If there was a power cut or my internet went down will my digital voice still work and please don't say use a mobile or a battery backup. I have an upstairs line extension I paid for that is also then useless unless I fit in adapters ect. I find all that annoying I don't need the change. You might be happy with digital voice but I don't find it necessary until the full turn off.  If when I'm paying £36.50 there is no issue with keeping my landline why at £15 social tariff is digital voice being given when the manager and agents themselves say it can be refused

Thanks

[iniltous]

I suppose ultimately it may simply be for you a choice , between keeping what you have or saving money, basically which is more important to you ?, I guess  the only reason you are interested in the social tariff BT Essential,  was the cost saving.

If it turns out that moving onto this social tariff requires you accepting T&C’s , which include having to use DV  if you require a telephony service, and that is unacceptable, cancel the order ,  it’s obviously  unfortunate that you were advised that you could keep a PSTN telephone service , if it turns out that you cannot , and DV is unavoidable if you reside in an area where DV  is required for ‘new’ customers , but presumably  you can simply cancel your move to BT Essential and remain on what you have with whoever you have it with, if your preference is to keep your  PSTN service until you current provider migrates you to their version of DV , or removes telephony from their packages.

[nolimitzz]

Hi I'm on the Victoria exchange and they are still selling copper services. If this was the case for the last 5 weeks why have I been repeatedly told I don't need to take up digital voice.

There is an option just to take the phone for £10 do the options are there just that my order keeps getting messed up. A manager is going to ring me today to discuss. Thanks for your input appreciate it. I'm with BT and assume the full move will be in 2025

[jac_95]

Hi @nolimitzz 

Just to clarify some things around the industry move to Digital Voice also known as VoIP and Internet Calls. This is being done by 600+ providers be that Sky, BT, Virgin, TalkTalk ect....

There are some key dates:

• From September 5th 2023 no new traditional analogue phone service will be able to be placed and you will only be offered Digital Voice. 
  This applies when making changes to an existing contract (e.g renewing or upgrading your package) as well as moving providers.
  From this date all providers will be doing mass migrations off the traditional analogue phone service  (PSTN) in order to make sure all customers are off the PSTN well in advance if the closure date (below)
  
  
• December 2025, the complete closure of the traditional analogue phone service (PSTN). Everyone must be off it well in advance of that date otherwise they will be cut off. 
  
  

BT Consumer have announced they will looking to restart their customer mass migrations to Digital Voice this Spring: https://newsroom.bt.com/getting-digital-voice-right-for-our-customers/

In terms of powercuts, BT Consumer is obligated to work with you in order to find an appropriate solution to allow their Digital Voice service to continue to work for a period of time when there's a power outage or for you to have an alternative way to make emergency calls. As an example they can offer a UPS or battery backup device and will soon also be offering other solutions such as hybrid handsets that connect to the mobile network too.

More info on this industry wide change at https://landlinesgo.digital/

[RIC9380]

Sorry but I still don't understand the first bit of your reply.  My BT Digital Voice service is FTTC (has been since 2019) and the only difference, apart from excellent call quality, are the extra free features. 

Look, your traditional landline could always develop a fault preventing calls in or out - nothing is 100% infallible. 

The free BT Advanced Digital Home Phone has a large number pad and is as easy to use a traditional DECT cordless phone.  If you want to continue using an existing traditional phone (non DECT) you can still do so by just plugging it into the back of the supplied free BT Smart Hub 2.  If you require DV handsets in other rooms you can have them.  If you want to use another traditional telephone in another room where you already have an extension you can still have that.  You just plug your home phone’s existing telephone line cord into the socket on the top of the BT DV Adapter and you'll have the same dial tone as when it was plugged into the old extension socket.

Whether or not you are annoyed by change isn't going to alter the fact that the ancient telephony service will eventually cease. 

Regardless of what anyone tells you, BT Consumer is not a monopoly.  It is one of the many companies operating in the UK providing broadband, home phone, mobile and entertainment services.  It is perfectly entitled to design its packages on offer to the public.  If it decides that BT Essentials comes with DV then sobeit.  In fact it makes sense as DV has not really been paused as BT has a POTS cut-off deadline to  meet as agreed with OFCOM.  If you don't like the product on offer and the conditions attached to it then are free to shop around and choose another telecom provider.  Now that seems to me a lot more "change" than simply upgrading to DV for free now.

I don't know how you transmit your tracker information to complete shopping surveys but BT and OFCOM have been liaising with companies whose equipment will not be compatible with DV for years and it is up to those companies to work with the UK telecom industry to upgrade and come up with a fix.  It is possible.  Others have already done it.

RIC9380

[nolimitzz]

Yes I see the advantages but even on FFTTC I get low speeds not 50+ mb like most people. All I'm saying I would like to stick to what I currently have and if it's available till 2025 I would rather much prefer to have copper till then.

As regards to still using the upstairs extension I assume for the BT adapter you'll need to plug it into an electric socket. Now in the master bedroom I only have one double socket which is at the other end of the room to where my extension socket is. Does this matter ? Would I be required to plug a normslyhandset into the plug adapter and expect it to work or would it need to be a DV phone?

Also how many free handsets do BT provide? I would require at least 2.

I know PSTN will cease but not until 2025. The managers assured me I can continue without DV time being and that's all I'm asking for. Not looking to get into the pros and cons but thanks for your input

[iniltous]

If the question is why were you told something repeatedly that may turn out to be wrong , then although it shouldn’t happen, it also isn’t much of a surprise when you have regulatory barriers between the various groups of the same company.

From a BT Consumer point of view , BT are reliant on their suppliers , be it Openreach or whatever the current title of the exchange/transmission/power organisations are , BTwholesale, BT TSO , BT Technology, all have their own programs and dates ,  the main programs are the PSTN switch off and the move to FTTP , as the PSTN switch off is the most pressing, that is what’s driving BT as a consumer facing company, moving its customers, where it can , onto DV.

Generally ( irrespective of what you may have been told ) ,  DV if it’s available is the standard telephony offer , so ‘new’ customers will be offered it , and BT customers changing packages , that start a new ‘contract’ are effectively considered new customers, there is one possible exception, if a customer wanted telephony only , at the moment that would be a PSTN connection as the devices (BT) , systems  and procedures (BT/BTw/OR) to supply a extremely limited bandwidth broadband connection that will only operate as way to deliver VoIP type telephony (DV in BT case )  are not yet in place, so PSTN is the less than ideal choice .

A word of caution though,  someone ordering telephony only , thinking they could then order broadband as a way of circumventing all this , would in all likelihood be converted to DV as part of the conditions of taking BT broadband , basically anyone using BT wanting to remain on PSTN for as long as then can , possibly until the very end of 2025 , would be advised to remain on whatever package they are on , and if when they were advised that migration was to be imposed, attempt to find a different company that isn’t closing its PSTN type telephony.

[nolimitzz]

Hi an unrelated question. I was emailed saying my estimate download speed will be 34-36mb with upload of 8-9mb minimum guarantee of 39mb

Checking my speed from the router settings I'm on 25mb down and 5.9 upload. I am under the guarantee minimum can thus be sorted out ? With my old provider I was getting 33mb down.